In order to take kids out or timid adults...

I am new to Cat sailing. My wife and I took "Don't Panic" (written upside down of course) :) out for the first time and most of the rigging went well. We took it out in moderate to heavy winds (not our choice...) AMAZING FAST! We went 35-40 max speed!

Question: There is not a lot of room on the trampoline for others and with a low boom... has anyone tried slower sailing with just the jib? Will this cause difficulties in steering or pitch polling?

Interesting facts: We went out trying to turtle the boat to get over the "what-if" questions. It went well. It was surprising how slow the boat turns upside down. Thank you to all on here that posted how to right the boat. We tried and it went well. Note to self for next time: to release the main and jib before righting the boat :) However, thanks to all! Could nto do it with out ya!

first off you shouldn't really take out kids or noobs in anything but light winds

neither you or they will enjoy it

sailing without a jib is a very common way of depowering the rig and creating space on the tramp

in light winds tacking will be pretty much the same as with jib

in medium winds you'll need good speed going into the turn, release lots of sheet as you cross the wind and know how to back out of a blown tack

in strong winds the hulls and rig will act as weather vanes and put you into irons very, very easily. and without a jib you will HAVE TO know how to back out of a stalled turn

blowing the traveller as you go head to wind works very well on my boat when i sail without jib in strong winds

He asked about sailing with just the jib, and leaving the main sail on shore.

erice

first off you shouldn't really take out kids or noobs in anything but light winds

neither you or they will enjoy it

sailing without a jib is a very common way of depowering the rig and creating space on the tramp

in light winds tacking will be pretty much the same as with jib

in medium winds you'll need good speed going into the turn, release lots of sheet as you cross the wind and know how to back out of a blown tack

in strong winds the hulls and rig will act as weather vanes and put you into irons very, very easily. and without a jib you will HAVE TO know how to back out of a stalled turn

blowing the traveller as you go head to wind works very well on my boat when i sail without jib in strong winds

It all comes down to center of forces. As far as i know a 16 prindle does not have centerboards and thus you could probrably sail around. I have sailed monohulls with only jib before but windward performance was limited. If you give it a try head upwind for the way out so that if it goes to hell you can sail downwind back to shore. You must sail in some deep water to turtle a 25ish foot mast. I am in mobile bay and it tops out at 8ft deep(lots of mud)

I agree with EricE that even experienced sailors make mistakes in heavy air... and it is a matter of split second timing (at times)... that is flirting with disaster. Glad you did ok, and were safe.

i would NOT sail with jib only.

also the mast/main/leach/blocks all work in conjunction as your backstay and add strength to your mast (preventing your mast from breaking forward in this case by the jib)

i.e. with a spinnaker... you sheet the main in hard and leave it... you don't sheet out (EVER)... or risk your mast.

turtle

We took it out in moderate to heavy winds (not our choice...) AMAZING FAST! We went 35-40 max speed!

Glad to hear you had a good time out in moderate winds. I agree with Andrew and EricE that you should really learn in ligher air and work up to heavy winds. I have never sailed a P16, but I know how my H18 acts in 25+ winds and you need to know what you are doing in order to be reasonably safe in those conditions.

As I recall most cats max speed is about the speed of the wind, but greatly dependent on sailers skills. I would recommend both a wind gauge and a GPS when you go out so you can see what you are actually sailing in, not to mention a VHF radio incase you have problems. I know I would not go out in conditions that would enable me to go 35-40mph on my cat, unless it was on a trailer.

--
Scott,
‘92 H18 w/SX wings
‘95 Hobie Funseeker 12 (Holder 12)
‘96/‘01/‘14 Hobie Waves
--

I've never sailed my P16 with the jib only. I am concerned about damaging my boat. As Andrew pointed out everything works in conjuncion.

Please allow me to kick this dead horse. I'm trying to figure out how to use my P16 for coastal fishing. With the full rig it is not practical, but if I could loose the main and boom, it might work. I would think that figuring out a way to attach the main halyard to the main sheet would be enough to act as a backstay in moderate winds. I welcome any thoughts on this idea. Keep in mind that I would not have to travel very far or fast to get to the places I want to go due to the ability to beach launch.

--
Mike Brady
Sugar Land, TX
Sailing off Magnolia Beach in Lavaca Bay TX
http://358degrees.blogspot.com/
P16 "Pooh Cat"
--

About 6 years ago I wanted to sail, was solo, the wind was around 30mph. I took the Nacra 5.7 out with jib only. The GPS showed 10mph.
It sailed/tacked fine.
I have also dropped the main on several boats & sailed in on jib alone. (I park my Cats on Seadoo lifts, the approach to the dock is congested, & the prevailing wind means I often have to drop the sail with the wind at 45* or more to the bows. The H18 is a b*tch to get the sail down if it is not facing into the wind).
I have never worried about a backstay. the jib head is only 2/3 up the the mast.
Give it a try, I assume you are not fishing in hurricanes.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--

Quote

I would think that figuring out a way to attach the main halyard to the main sheet would be enough to act as a backstay in moderate winds.

sure! you could use the main halyard, and add a little line to the ring and tie it off to the rear beam.
I just can't understand why anyone would want to use a beach cat for fishing - it is far from the best choice for that .. but to each their own - go for it.

Quote

I took the Nacra 5.7 out with jib only. The GPS showed 10mph.

i have sailed (jib only and bare pole) down wind without problem

upwind - i have yet to see anyone who can sail (well) jib only upwind - i found i lost more ground than gained
but if you said you have done it without problem - cool

The 10mph was on a reach, you're right upwind is not great, but I could definitely sail, I could get home if the main blew out or halyard snapped. That was a skeg hull boat.
I have fished from a small Cat, (Hobie Wave), in the Caribbean, trolled a lure at a good speed. We were quite successful.
It sounds like the OP just wants to use his Cat to get somewhere, perhaps anchor & cast later.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--

I really doubt that you can break the mast with the jib. I also doublt that the halyard helps as a backstay unless it's dyneema, otherwise it would just stretch. A couple times I have sailed with the jib only to make a smoother landing, because the ramp is steep and exposed, just at the wrong angle to the wind. It's hard to take the main down on the water, i rather landed on a protected spot, took it down and continued with jib only.
If you want to go fishing, which also seems quite odd to me, you should lock mast rotation. get a mast rotator and cleat both sides, otherwise the mast will be swinging all the time with the waves.

https://vimeo.com/201367382
There, end of the video

I don't think 35-40 knots boat speed is likely. I think it would capsize or pitchpole right away if it got close to that fast.

--
Tim
Collierville (Memphis), TN
Supercat 15--sold :(
Hobie monocat--given
Vanguard 15--traded for...
Nacra 4.5--sold
Nacra 5.7
Hobie 14–sold to make room for...
Supercat 17–sold
--

Quote

I don't think 35-40 knots boat speed is likely. I think it would capsize or pitchpole right away if it got close to that fast.

I am certain no stock prindle 16 was doing much more than 20knots (ever) unless it was falling off the side of the earth

Quote

I really doubt that you can break the mast with the jib. I also doublt that the halyard helps as a backstay unless it's dyneema, otherwise it would just stretch.

I would agree there is little risk to the mast with jib alone (under most conditions)- I was new to spinnaker sailing and I think I was overly concerned when i wrote that 8 years ago.

If you want to use a beachcat for fishing, why not just take the mast down and mount a trolling motor. At least that way you will have no obstructions and will basically have a wide open fishing platform that cuts through the water like a knife through butter.
I saw a video on you tube where a guy took a Hobie 16 and added a kayak hull to the center, built a sturdy frame that was attached to the old tramp frame and had a trolling motor with dual props. It was strictly for fishing, no longer a sailboat, but that's a great way to repurpose an old worn out beachcat. Personally, I have an old Jon boat to use for fishing, only yesterday I used the Jon boat for retrieving a R/C boat that I flipped over while jumping waves at the lake, Lol.



Edited by martyr on Sep 05, 2017 - 03:37 AM.

--
Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
--

What about keeping the mast and using the boom for seating?

Andinista

What about keeping the mast and using the boom for seating?

Dood!
Have you ever sat on a P16 boom?
That kerf is tough on the biscuits!


--
Sheet In!
Bob
_/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
--

klozhald

Andinista

What about keeping the mast and using the boom for seating?

Dood!
Have you ever sat on a P16 boom?
That kerf is tough on the biscuits!

we are talking about going fishing on a P16... I assume it's not for the fun...