I just found this forum, great to see a forum with decorum. No flames & insults, just info.
I have sailed some larger (27'-38') monohulls and currently own a little Bombardier Invitation, (16')dinghy. I was hankering for the idea of a Cats speed & fun factor, so rented a Hobie Bravo after reccomendation from a dealer. Was dissapointed, it wasn't as fast as the 28 year old Invitation, & tended to bury the hulls in a gybe. I next tried out a Hobie Wave a couple of weeks ago in Barbados. Lots of fun for wife & I, but I think I want a little bit more.
I am in fairly good shape, only weight 170 lbs wet, & am not scared of learning. Technical issues don't bother me, ( I fly a Boeing 777 for a living). I do quite a bit of solo sailing, but probably have friend(s)along 30%-40% of the time. Most friends are inexperienced sailors.
I will keep the boat at a waterfront property, so rigging will be a once a year chore. It will be freshwater sailed on a 19 mile x 16 mile Canadian lake, not much traffic.
The bay I am on is 4 miles x 2 miles, generally 10-15 knts wind, smallish waves. Going outside the bay (during big wind days-20kts+ can have 2'-3' swells.
Given my size,experience. and conditions am I retarded to be looking at a Nacra 5.7 in pristine shape?
I have some shallows,(hit an uncharted very small reef at full tilt in the Invitation, but tht's another story), and so am partial to the boardless design. A 70 yr old gent is selling this Nacra due to age & health. It has been inside stored, 2 new traps,all new lines & not much use the last 5 years & price is $1800-$2000 Canadian $.Prices may be higher in Canada as we just don't have the numbers of boats for sale, & most are imported from USA.
Can I single hand this, can I sail it without the jib to depower, could I ever right it again by my self using bags/righting beam? Or should I sulk back to my little Invitation? Anything in particular to look for during inspection? I am going to see it tomorrow, but won't be able to sail it...to damn cold here this time of year.
I love the looks of these Nacras, fell in love after seeing one in Barbados, this 5.7 is probably the only one in my area.
Apologies for the long post, but the more info, hopefully he better you can advise me. I should add, I have little experience in heavy weather, and would only rate my abilities as beginning intermediate. This boat will never be raced, except perhaps in fun alongside totally different types at the cottage.
Thanks



edited by: Edchris177, Nov 26, 2009 - 11:33 AM

Edchris

From the above post you have everything in your favour, mast up storage, dagger boardless boat, waterfront property, I say go for it. You will easily be able to single hand this boat, no problems, do not sail without jib as this tool helps with tacking the boat(see posts on this website about using the jib), the boat will initially seem intimidating, but after 1 season you will be asking yourself if the 5.7 is a litle small. I suggest a righting bag if sailing solo, you will have some difficulty righting the cat, you will need every advantage with extra weight. Sail only in conditions equal to your level of skill initially, as you gain experience you will find yourself able to venture out in more adverse conditions. The price indicated is a really good price for your boat, but negotiating is always advantageous.
Regards the boat, inspect hulls for previous damage, delamination which is indicated by soft spots when gentle pressure is applied to hull, look at hull bottoms to make sure that abrasion has not worn bottoms thin, make sure hulls are not taking on water, pull plugs if any and see if water drains, usually one would gently pressure the hull with air and spray water soap mixture over entire hull to check for leaks but that may not always be possible. I would rely on experience that you have acquired with many years of visual inspection of an aircraft prior to flight. If the jib is not setup with a furler this is something you can plan at a later stage, helps to depower in an emergency.

Other than that, it seems to be a good boat, at a good price, if the sails are in good condition and with the rigging recently replaced better still. You can visit this website often and postv any/all questions, we're here to help accelerate your learning curve. Keep us posted.



--
TurboHobo
H14T
H16
P18
G-Cat 5.0
P16
--

Go for it! The price is right and its a beautiful boat. I have a Nacra 5.2 in similar conditions and am super happy with it! Boardless and boomless are better for recreational sailors especially if you are taking out inexperienced friends. The 5.7 doesn't suffer much without them.

What part of Canada (I'm looking for people to sail with)?

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Wow, that was quick, I just posted, not really expecting any replies for a day or two. I hate to be rushed in any decision making, but I just found this site & set up an account.
I am going to inspect the boat tomorrow morning.
For Wolfman, my cottage is on Lake SImcoe, up in Orillia Ont.
I read through as many of the threads as I had time for. I was initially worried that an 18.5' boat was to big for a newbie. I didn't mind tackiling anything with the little Invitation because it was so easy to right after capsizing. I will be much more conservative with a boat that I can't get up by myself.
I had read some posts regarding sailing without the jib, & to release the traveler along with the main sheet & it would come around no problem. At least I think that was what the poster said. Pardon my ignorance, I am not fully conversant with all the jargon the more experienced people use.
I have done quite a bit of internet searching and have not found very much relating specifically to the 5.7. I "think" the newer 570 is pretty much the same boat, but even Nacra's website only gives a few details. Any ideas where I could find a full manual, especially pertaining to setting up/rigging the boat?
The gent selling it is rather poor health now, & will not be around to show me the ropes. It is fully rigged now,(sans sails of course, but I think I can figure that out next spring)so I intend to take many pictures & label every line & cable as I take it down to be able to trailer it home. I also intend to buy, (actually get relatives to buy under guise of Christmas)a couple of the publications I saw on the Murrays Website pertaining to beach cats.
I don't think lessons from anyone experienced are going to be an option at my place, do others have any recommendations for the best publications. I have the Boating for Dummies guide put out by Transport CAnada, which is mostly common sense, a couple of sailing books & Chapmans bible to everything on the water. Do you know of any guides specifically for Cats?
I'm glad to hear that so far 2 out of 2 posters think I am not insane for considering this boat.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--

i 2nd the "go buy it" brigade, that's a good price

in light and medium winds you will find jibless tacking easy, this changes when the winds get get stronger

on my 5.2, when sailing without the jib releasing the traveller helps the hulls pivot below the rig without either weather-vaning the boat into irons

BUT, the 5.2 has daggerboards which give the boat something to pivot around, the longer 5.7 does not have the daggers so may not tack around so easily...

no problems, just learn to back the boat around into a tack and leave yourself lots of space for tacks when the wind picks up

when it's blowing hard don't sail right to the edge of the lake, and into little holes between concrete docks and moored boats because if you blow a tack then your options then as you slowly are blown backwards into the dock or moored boats anchor line narrow;o)

get 1 or 2 good cat books to read over the winter and you will be fine

rick white's "catamaran racing for the 90's" is pretty much the most complete catamaran book out there and is perfect for the older boats as the newer books refer to newer boats, and with mylar sails and spinnakers they are slightly different

the 5.7 is a big boat

if you do find it too much you should be able to sell it for much the same as you paid for it

if funds permit the weta trimaran should also be considered





edited by: erice, Nov 26, 2009 - 04:08 PM

Nothing like hands on training, if you've sailed before then you have a basic knowledge of wind on sail forces. Granted, 18 feet is a lot of boat to start out on but as mentioned before, stick to wind/weather conditions on a par with your level of experience and you will have few problems, also, remember you have the huge advantage of mast-up beaching of your cat which is such a bonus and kind of neutralizes the size disadvantage.

For your level of experience, the following chart would apply:-

Light winds = 5-8 mph
medium winds = 9-12 mph
heavy winds = 13 mph and over

Keep in mind that as you gain more experience this rough estimate of a chart will change. As an example, I was out on a lake the last time we had temps in the 70's F, the wind was clocking 15 mph plus, I was trapped out as usual going as fast as I could go when I had an epiphany; I could not remember when I had last sailed sitting comfortably bored on the tramp!!! which made me remember how scared I used to get when winds got over 12 mph!!!
And I sail a little H16.

So learn how to rig your boat, put it in the water........................ and just sail

Turbo

Nacra owners are rabid and dedicated. ;) We love our boats.

Oh Well, I'm near Kenora, Ontario on the Manitoba side.

Manuals are easy to find for that boat. The pre 1985 manuals can be found in the technical help gallery on this website. The post 1985 and newer manuals can be downloaded from the Nacra website (or a couple of other locations I think, or just ask here and someone will e-mail it to you). You can tell the year from the number stamped on the hull near the rudders.

The 570 is essentially the same boat with some updated rigging and I think it has an updated sail plan (smaller jib, flat top main).

If you have questions regarding rigging just feel free to ask on here or look at the technical help gallery for photos.

The 570 is a bit of a bigger cat, but not unreasonably so, all the Nacra`s up to that length rid and handle similarly (fast and forgiving). You will probably be happy single handing it without the jib within 3-4 good days and with the jib within a month.

Check out The Catamaran Book by Brian Phipps and Catamaran Sailing from Start to Finish by Phil Berman. I have them both and thought they were really good. The catamaran racing books will likely be less useful for you but they are good to have when you get advance. I taught myself to rig and sail my 5.2 last summer without any difficulty or other sailors on the lake. Like turbo says the most important thing is to get it on the water and sail, the learning will come.

Good Luck!

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Thanks Wolfman. I found some original rigging manuals on a website & downloaded them. They are around 22 pages, I haven't gone through them but they seem to bring you from taking it out of the box to final assembly.
I don't know what year the boat is, as the owner is absent, but I will find out tomorrow. I found a Cat buying guide on the web & it gave me some good info.
I also found Phil Bermans book for cheap on Ebay & Amazon, so I'll get a copy. We have to be up at 0600 hr tomorrow to make the 3 hr drive to see it. I'll post what I decide when I get back, though I must admit, you guys must all be salesmen, if it is as good as shape as advertised, you have convinced me to buy it.
What is that saying about fools & Angels fearing to tread...Ha Ha


--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--

Well I don't think you can go far wrong as long as all the parts are there to start with and the hulls and sails are in good shape. All the rigging is easily replaceable and parts are easy to come by. People here are very helpful if you have a problem, a question or just need some advice.

Regards,
Dave

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
--

Just a thought, but you could alway add a roller furling system for the jib, so when it starts to blow a little harder just furl the jib and if the wind turn light on the way home just roll it out. Well worth the money and effort.

I would definitely go for it, although by this time it sounds like you already did.

I've sailed a 5.2 and a 5.5, and crewed a 5.8, never even seen a 5.7. My guess is that it will be able to take you for a ride and overpower you very easily, but that's not too big an issue if you stay out of really gusty wind and get a good righting bag.

Without daggers I'd keep the jib at all times. You should be able to depower it a little if you need to.

Good luck.

If you have the pivmatic kick ups along with those skegs you shouldn't have any issue coming in to shore, even if the wind does get a little out of control on you.

Edit:
After looking here:
Nacra 5.0 Slp 2-up N5.0 77.0 80.5 78.5 76.2 73.0
Nacra 5.2 Slp 2-up N5.2 72.1 78.0 74.8 71.6 67.4
Nacra 5.5 Slp 8.5' N5.5 67.0 73.5 69.5 65.7 61.2
Nacra 5.5 Uni 11' beam See: 18SM-2
Nacra 5.5 Uni 8.5' N5.5U 69.7 74.4 71.9 69.0 64.5
Nacra 5.7 2-up N5.7 72.6 75.5 74.8 72.2 68.6
Nacra 5.8 No.Amer. 2-up N5.8NA 66.5 70.4 68.5 65.4 62.0
Nacra 5.8 Orig. 2-up N5.8 66.6 72.1 69.3 65.7 62.2

I'd think its pretty easily controllable solo. Just stay out of gusty conditions.



edited by: yurdle, Nov 27, 2009 - 11:50 AM

--
Rob
OKC
Pile of Nacra parts..
--

I´ve sailed Lake Simkoe in the early ´70´s when Reg Jaworski was the Hobie Cat dealer in Orilla. He was pilot for Air Canada--so you´re just continuing the torch. Very warm lake in summer. Just use crew for first times out (any kid will do), then try single handing reefing main if you have to, but use jib. Pete

Seems to me you have the perfect deal staring you in the face absolutely no way can you turn this down. Although I've never sailed this boat, its the best looking daggerless design Ive seen. Yes this is going to be a lot of boat for solo but very doable. I got a used Hobie 20, my first cat, last year and this year I started soloing. If I can do it in that then you can do it in the 5.7. I weigh 230 and consider myself an experienced sailor on many different designs, mostly monos. Ypu have to pick your days, 10-15 is the top end for me. Make sure the mast is sealed before you go out! If it turtles you are screwed.
Research the capsize drill and have it memorized. Practice righting with crew. Don't meanto freak you out but once you have this down the fear factor subsides. The nacra is a first class boat. Get it the tribe has spoken!

erice

get 1 or 2 good cat books to read over the winter and you will be fine

rick white's "catamaran racing for the 90's" is pretty much the most complete catamaran book out there and is perfect for the older boats as the newer books refer to newer boats, and with mylar sails and spinnakers they are slightly different

I enthusiastically second this. Every chapter I read in White's book makes me want to create a laminated method card to take on the boat with me. Reading about doing roll tacks with cats, even if one is planning to solo, helps to understand weight distribution. Get this book, it's not just for racers.

erice

if funds permit the weta trimaran should also be considered

I've been interested in the Weta for a while.

I just recently talked to my local dealer who said he went to a Weta demo at the club where all the big cat sailors keep their boats. He knows them all and talked to each one as they came off the water after trying out the tri. He said they all seemed pretty unimpressed with the boat. It's compact, and easy to rig for sure, but apparently underpowered for guys used to trapping out and going fast.

I'm wondering if anyone here has checked out the boat and can add to, or counter, this information.

Oh and capsizes are only scary until you have done one or two. Then they become no big deal. Most of them are slow motion deals where you just have to slide off the boat. You can see some really spectacular ones on youtube but those are normally due to a really bad pitchpole (really unlikey in a 5.7) or when you are REALLY pushing the speed on a windy day.

If you make sure the mast is sealed you are likely to be able to right it by yourself or at most with 2 people. If you still have a problem you can rig up a ghetto mast float a number of ways or get one of the many righting aids out there.

D,

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
--

I've been interested in the Weta for a while.

I just recently talked to my local dealer who said he went to a Weta demo at the club where all the big cat sailors keep their boats. He knows them all and talked to each one as they came off the water after trying out the tri. He said they all seemed pretty unimpressed with the boat. It's compact, and easy to rig for sure, but apparently underpowered for guys used to trapping out and going fast.

I'm wondering if anyone here has checked out the boat and can add to, or counter, this information.[/quote]

the thing with the weta is that it is so easy

it's not going to do much for an adrenaline junkie who has just unhooked from a beachcat trapeze or stepped off skiff racks

but as any skiff sailor will tell you, there are days when you just don't feel like having to work that hard while you sail

and the weta is good for those days and the days when you want to take non-sailors or children out for a sail

when sailing my 5.2, to get it to go well, i have to sort of sail it on the edge, physically and mentally, it's a huge rush to have it up on 1 hull while hanging off the trapeze inching forward or back along the non-slip to get the leeward bow just sunk into the water right for best speed

but it is a BIG boat to solo and on our small lake i can't take it into all the small coves and up against the cliffs as much as i used to in my 13' 420 dingy, and while i can sail it when it's white-topping, it's more survival than enjoyment

also the weta is my 1st gennaker boat and it's much more fun downwind in a blow than the 5.2, which is best running across the wind, also as gennaker on the weta is so flat when we get very light winds it can be used as a reaching sail

i did look at putting a roller furling screacher on the 5.2 but to a degree it would be putting lipstick on a pig and the boat would spend even more time on it's side when the mountain winds came twisting down the valley

and it's already the fastest sailboat on the lake;o)

so the weta tri isn't going to challenge beachcat/skiff dominance in racing or thrills, but it will enable many more people, (younger, older, less experienced sailors etc) to get very close to beachcat/skiff speeds and thrills without the hard work or risks






edited by: erice, Nov 27, 2009 - 06:02 PM

sounds like you have some time before you can sail so you shouldnt be in a rush but it is a great price! h 16 or p16s make great first cats as there is a learning curve on cats and they still give you all the thrills. your main difference is tacking and of course righting. an 18 ft boat can be a beast rightin by yourself although my 118lb brother can right his h18 solo(there are some tricks, he is amazing!). if availability is an issue(other cats), go for it! you will figure it out, you fly jets for petes sake! if you buy the boat now then your biggest problem will be that this winter will seem like the longest winter ever(common problem)! oh, you will become addicted also, its habbit forming. good luck, bill.

--
Check out "Prindle Sailors" on Facebook!
bill harris
hattiesburg, mississippi
prindle 16- "BLUE RIBBON"
--

Quote

For your level of experience, the following chart would apply:-

Light winds = 5-8 mph
medium winds = 9-12 mph
heavy winds = 13 mph and over

As I have posted here before I went from a H14T to a 91 N5.8na. Although I sailed H16 and H18...NOTHING could have prepared me for my boat(Snarling Beast) on a big wind day. (Clue 1 should have been the comment my seller made about having terrified his wife on several occasions, Clue 2: Its name was and is "Chaos II".) Big wind is 13+. To avoid the steep learning curve and mishaps of my first two years,(My beach nickname was "Crash") follow above wind speed guidlines and you will LOVE the 5.7. You will also build up confidence and experience that allows you to master the higher wind speeds. Still for a big Nacra, 10-13 is really the sweet spot. Learn to travel out and when safe to cleat in. (Never over 13 and never above 10 single handed) Single handing....8-10mph. You will struggle get this beast righted on your own. You need crew for anything over 13. Agree boomless and boardless is a great combination. Boards are a pain in the ....! Having grown into it, my wife and I love our boat and would never consider switching, except to a new Nacra!