Location:
I am located in Richmond Virginia. I am a school teacher and want to purchase a beach cat. Being a teacher I am on a VERY limited budget. I need the boat that does many things well. I will be sailing in lakes, rivers, the Chesapeake Bay, The outer Banks NC ocean and sound.

Experience:
I am 36 years old, in average shape, and I have sailed sunfish, lasers, vangaurd 15's and other various small monohulls. In addition I have sailed Hobie's at resorts (probably wave's). I have never sailed a boat with a trapeze and would like that challenge but am in no rush.

Needs:
1. Cost. Boat must be affordable
2. Boat needs to be trailered and set up single handed
3. I need the boat to be able to be sailed single handed and have the option to reef the main or leave the jib at home in high winds.
4. I need the boat to draft very shallow for sound sailing in NC. No Daggerboards.
5. I weigh 240lbs and should be able to solo sail most 16 or 18 foot cats. I do want to be able to carry one additional crew member 180 lbs and still fly a hull/ have a sporty ride.
6. I want to be able to have me, wife, and kids (approx 460 lbs) and still be able to "sail". Doesn't have to be sporty, or race car like just be able to move and have a family day on the water.
7. Buying used I know I may need to buy parts so parts availability is a big plus


So far I am considering Hobie 16, Prindle 16, and Prindle 18.

I like the 16 foot boats as they seem to be easier to solo rig and sail.
I like the parts availability of the Hobie 16 but wonder if it can sail with my family for fun time but still fly a hull with me and 1 crew member on board at a total weight of 420 lbs.

I am thinking the Prindle 16 checks most of my boxes but hope I can find parts when needed and find a boat in decent shape at the right price. I would also like some feedback on my thoughts as I have not sailed ANY of these boats.

Thanks!
Nick

Do some searches here, there are quite a few threads from people wanting what you want.
The unfortunate part is you want a boat that does almost everything...so, you are going to have to compromise.
I would say solo & shallow are your most important criteria, followed by ability to carry weight. Look for a
Nacra 5.0. They are skeg hulls,(shallow water), tough & can carry weight. I would say the 5.7 is better for multiple crew, but at 19' it becomes harder to set up solo.
I sail the 5.0 solo in up to survival winds, & it still hauls with 2 adults,(360lb). They are boomless, a big plus if you want to "cruise" with wife & kids. The uncluttered tramp is your friend on those days. IMHO the 5.0 kicks the Prindle 16.
There was a nice one one the beach somewhere around N Jersey.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--

Contact Dan Berger, he lives in VA, he's an experienced mariner and cat sailor, he will put you into what you need. Go "member panel" - "registered users list" and look for him under the letter "D". Send him a PM

R

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RnBCYC/info

This is a small club that sails beachcats in the Richmond/Fredricksburg/ Nova area. Ask to join. The folks will be glad to help. GH

--
'82 Super Cat 15
Hull #315
Virginia
Previously owned: '70 H14, '79 H16, '68 Sailmaster 26, '85 H14T
--

We love our Hobie Getaway w wings...but I'm 66 and don't scramble around like I used to...but it's a great family boat and kids love it...

--
Don Mc
1979 Hobie 16 - WhiteCat
2013 Hobie Getaway
--

420lbs on a Hobie 16 is quite a lot. I sailed it at 350lbs and thought that was too much. You could probably fly the hulls on some days.

420lbs for 2 people is firmly in i20 territory, your a big guy so your at the top end of most of the common solo boats, add your crew and your way too much for those boats.

Are you sure you have to require no boards? The Hobie 18 would be a solid boat to consider.

What is your budget?



Edited by bacho on Dec 31, 2014 - 10:49 PM.

--
Greenville SC

Offering sails and other go fast parts for A-class catamarans
--

"Are you sure you have to require no boards? The Hobie 18 would be a solid boat to consider."- I could sail with boards but my only concern is when sailing the sound in NC it is often shallow out of nowhere with sand bars etc... I don't want to have to pull boards up while sailing either solo or maybe with one of my kids. Right now my 4 yr old daughter loves sailing with me in my sunfish and my 1 yr old seems to love climbing over the boat so he might be wanting to go this summer. Not enough rm for both in a sunfish and lets be honest with me at 230- 240 adding a kid to that in a sunfish makes performance drop a bit So I would prefer no boards but if the right deal came along and the boat had boards I probably wouldn't cry about it.

"What is your budget?"- I am in the beginning stages of planning, saving, etc... Not much right now but will continue to save more as time goes by. I would like to save as much as possible as I know that buying a "cheap" boat will mean more possibility for repair. I would LOVE a new boat but it is not in the cards for me.

I had been thinking Hobie 16 or Prindle 16 for most of my needs but knowingly over loading it when sailing with family. I would LOVE a Super Cat 17 or Nacra 5.0 but $ seems to be a problem there. Sad thing about boat owners I have found is many feel that their boat is worth "more than that" so they don't sell and allow it to deteriorate into trash or scrap. Sad Sad Sad. Better off donating or giving something like that away than to let it sit and never be used. I have been really researching the boats and have gone from small monoull dinghies to 18 ft cats and still don't really know exactly which boat will do most of what I want it too well. Part of why I think a 16 ft boat will be okay is I have grossly overloaded my sunfish and still have a blast why wouldn't the same happen on a cat? Is that just a crazy thought?

Bacho on a side note...I like your pic. Nice Jeep. Looks like a CJ7 can't see the doors though to know for sure it is not a 5. I have a 2010 wrangler JKU 3 jeep will always have one!

Don- Thanks for the input on the getaway. I am very curious about this boat. I would own one in a minute but am not sure I would be able to find one in my range. Thanks for the advice though much appreciated.



Edited by lax71vcu on Jan 01, 2015 - 12:22 AM.

On the cats, especially a Hobie 16, extra weight will want to push the bows down when off the breeze. It becomes a lot less fun in a hurry.

IMO, I would be seeking an 18' boat considering your size.

The Hobie 18 is great for handling a range of weights well, and with wings would be a great family cruiser. They do have boards, however they are not nearly as long as some other boats.

The Prindle 18-2 and 19 would be options. The 19 would be a handful solo, but the 18-2 may be pretty nice for solo work. You are the ideal crew weight for the 18-2. (240lbs) both boats have center boards.

Supercat 17 would be an option as well, I have a friend who is a big fan of his.

Low end pricing on these would start in the $1,500 range, cheaper boats tend to wind up higher after repairs and updates. However you may find something cheaper, especially between now and spring.


Thanks on the Jeep comment, that was a mostly tubed YJ money pit with 60's and Chevy power. I parted it out thinking sail boats would be cheaper, didn't work out quite that way :)

--
Greenville SC

Offering sails and other go fast parts for A-class catamarans
--

I am thinking the Prindle 16 checks most of my boxes but hope I can find parts when needed and find a boat in decent shape at the right price. I would also like some feedback on my thoughts as I have not sailed ANY of these boats.

Thanks!
Nick[/quote]
I love my P16!!!



Edited by kernunnos on Jan 01, 2015 - 12:18 AM.

--
1975 P16 "Spring Rain"Sail # 642
Home Built 2004 Optimist-Delta "Unity"
So old it has Dino hide for a sail Chrysler "Pirateer"
Steve
Oyama BC
Lat 50.1167 N
Long 119.3667 W
1700 ft
--

I'm Bacho's friend who is a big fan of his SC17 (assume it's me anyway). They are great boats and can carry weight due to their big hulls. They are supported by Aquarius Sails which has the best customer support to be found in Beachcat sailing. Unfortunately used parts aren't too plentiful. These boats come up from time to time aT reasonable prices, so if you're saving up to buy keep an eye out.

Don't rule out the Hobie 18, it's a boat you can get into reasonably and there are a ton of used parts around. The boards aren't that big of deal really.

--
Mac
Midlands South Carolina
AHPC Viper USA 366
A Cat USA 366
Super Cat 17
--

" Don- Thanks for the input on the getaway. I am very curious about this boat. I would own one in a minute but am not sure I would be able to find one in my range. Thanks for the advice though much appreciated."

I'm not sure how old a Getaway you can find, they have been making them since @ least 2000? Also rotomolded hulls can't be repaired easily....
however new hulls aren't that bad @ $1000... we searched for a while and ended up with a 2013 demonstrator from Key Sails in Pensacola.
It's been a lot of fun for us and we can't wait till summer to get back out there. Great thing is it holds 1000 lbs....and rigs up in about 10-15 minutes and can be rigged solo with a few tricks...(I've never tried it) ....I haven't been on our H16 since we got it but it's now claimed by my wife who likes to solo....

--
Don Mc
1979 Hobie 16 - WhiteCat
2013 Hobie Getaway
--

I would go with a Prindle 18 and buy a P-16 mainsail in addition. By changing the rope halyard to rope/wire and adding a stop sleeve to the wire and a P-16 stop tang to mast, one could use either sail. The P-18 is 85 #'s lighter than H-18, no boards, and will carry the weight of two heavy guys. For solo use the P-16 main which I have in classifieds starting for $100. I also have most all Prindle parts. We'll probably do this in the Spring for a gal P-16 owner from L.A. changing to a P-18 (to race with us even). At 35 #"s more than a P-16, the P-18 is very manageable on the beach and very reasonable to buy. Pete

There's a *very* nice SC17 for sale in the Houston area. I know it's a drive for you, but might be worth the trip.

http://www.tcdyc.com/?q=node/1839

--
Tim
81 Hobie 16
87 Nacra 5.7
Austin, TX
--

Hi Nick,
I am in the same weight-range as you are, some 4 years ago
switched from mono-hulls ( dragons, etchells and cabin yachts) to
catamarans because I like to sail fast .
Bought a Prindle 18-2 cause it came on my path, it was my first cat.
Man, it was a handful. But after a while I learned to manage the new
way of sailing (yes, its so different compared to mono's) .
Problem with our weight is the Prindle 18-2 is designed for 2 persons
almost halve the weight of ours.
So, the cat is a perfect solo boat for us. There's a but.. if you are planning
to take wife and kids out it becomes a submarine and wil be hard to sail
specially in light and moderate winds ( times you want to take the family).
Next option is to look for a bigger boat in our price range , prindle 19 ,
nacra 6.0 maybe a old tornado.
Problem is you can't handle these cats solo.
My advise is to look for the 18 foot catamaran with the most buoyancy ,
most likely a nacra . Being said I'm not familiar with the SC range.
Don't know about the availability of dart catamarans in the US, the
dart 20 might be a winner. smaller rig and width and designed for cruising.

André

--
Tornado (80's Reg White)
Prindle 18-2 (sold)
Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.

Amsterdam, the Netherlands
--

Nick,

It will sound like I am biased because it is my boat, but you REALLY need to look at the Prindle 18 I have for sale. I a min stafford, about 90 minutes north of Richmond. I can personally attest that a 16 boat is not right for you, been there done that and my wife still has the scars. If you just want to tool around and go fast, there is not a better boat and it will fit much of what you want. To top it off there is a good group of guys to sail with the Geoff mentioned where you can get some tips. My boat is rigged up for ease of use. I installed a jib furler that makes it a breeze to sail by yourself and using the boat ramps that you will likely use in this area (beachfront is hard to come by). I also have a smaller sail I had cut down like Pete suggested - i never finished that project, but that will let you sail with more weight and not overstress the rig.

I am selling it because we have other committments and the boat deserves to be sailed. It is in very good shape.

Nick,

this might be the one, No daggerboards and in our price-range ???

keschwa

Nick,

It will sound like I am biased because it is my boat, but you REALLY need to look at the Prindle 18 I have for sale. I a min stafford, about 90 minutes north of Richmond. I can personally attest that a 16 boat is not right for you, been there done that and my wife still has the scars. If you just want to tool around and go fast, there is not a better boat and it will fit much of what you want. To top it off there is a good group of guys to sail with the Geoff mentioned where you can get some tips. My boat is rigged up for ease of use. I installed a jib furler that makes it a breeze to sail by yourself and using the boat ramps that you will likely use in this area (beachfront is hard to come by). I also have a smaller sail I had cut down like Pete suggested - i never finished that project, but that will let you sail with more weight and not overstress the rig.

I am selling it because we have other committments and the boat deserves to be sailed. It is in very good shape.

--
Tornado (80's Reg White)
Prindle 18-2 (sold)
Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.

Amsterdam, the Netherlands
--

I want to first say thank you for all the help and feed back on this. As a rookie I did not have the answers to these questions and am thankful for all the help. My previous sailing experience (limited in comparison) never really had any huge negative effects for exceeding recommended weights. Sun fish just loses a bit of free board and "sportiness" I didn't know if adding family to a cat would simply have this effect or other more serious effects. I am agreeing I think I need to look at the Prindle 18 to best meet my needs. That SC looks SWEET in TX. I was just down there this summer and yes it is a drive. I think the next boat i will probably seriously consider is the prindle 16 and or Nacara 5.0. Then the Hobie 16.

How are parts availability on the prindles? Masts, booms, cross bars, rudder bars, tillers, rudders, rudder mounting?

Nick,
You might want to also look at the Nacra 5.7. The 5.0 is a great boat, but still might be a tad small for the family. The 5.7 is also boardless, will handle a lot more weight, and offers a LOT of performance while still being a good solo boat. The negatives on a 5.7 are that you'll need a righting pole to get it upright by yourself if you capsize, and they generally sell for more than the 5.0s. I'm around the same size as you (6'4", 215) and really enjoyed my H16, but performance suffered when I had crew aboard. I never considered taking more than one other adult with me due to weight. The 5.7 will easily accomodate 3 adults and still fly a hull. You can also drive it WAAAAAY harder than a H16 without pitchpoling. The P16 offers quite a bit more buoyancy in the front end than the H16. Good luck in your search!

--
Tim
81 Hobie 16
87 Nacra 5.7
Austin, TX
--

Prindle 18-1 and Prindle 18-2 has same masts, rudders , crossbars ,
boom and rudder-bearings .
P 19 shares daggers and rudders. And trampoline.. with P18-2 .
Probably loads of parts in the US.
And don't get me started here, guys.....(mx , Imx, racing)
Just wanna help Nick

--
Tornado (80's Reg White)
Prindle 18-2 (sold)
Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.

Amsterdam, the Netherlands
--

Nick, I'll say it again, I always have parts for Prindles: masts for P-16 & 18, crossbars, rudder castings, rudders, tramps. Check my ads in classifieds. The one in Stafford sounds good to me. Another handy thing I do on all my Prindles is to put 4 footloops (9") evenly spaced on gunwale each side by drilling (3/8") hole thru the lip using 1/4" line. Great for handling boat off trailer or on beach & then they make good toe anchoring when on the trapeze. Pete

The best advice posted so far is to get down to that local club & hang around. I hardly know a Cat sailor who won't be happy to show you boats and/or take you out. A couple of afternoons of that is time well wasted, you will learn more than a 1000 posts. As you learn, you can wait for a deal.
Several have stated that your weight is "perfect" for boat "X". That comes with one large caveat...I don't mean to sound insulting, but is that 240lb an "athletic 240", or what we in Canada call Molson Muscle? (Molson being one of the biggest breweries here)
If it is the former, you will have no trouble handling an 18' or 19' Cat, on the water or land. If it is the latter, you might really dislike a larger Cat.
As said Prindle parts are readily obtained, but after being on a 16, I'll take the Nacra 5.0,(or newer 500).
Not to many around, but a Dart 18 would be a great boat for your needs, they shine in big wind. If your wind is usually around 25 tops, it is VERY hard to beat a Nacra 5.7.
I'll say it again, fast, can load the hell out of them & cruise, simple rig,(no boom no boards) & very forgiving. At 240lbs, you should be able to pop it right back up, assuming you can hike to a proper "plank" position. I'm only 170, & I solo right if the wind is up. Otherwise I use a bag. The 5.0 is almost the same to right.
For depowering, look for a furling jib, that is the single best thing I did to all my Cats.
Think carefully about boards, they are not a big deal, as long as you don't forget about them. I'm bloody glad I didn't have them when I first started. I think some of your Coastline is quite susceptible to shifting shallows. It is easy to remember a couple of reefs, not so easy when they become numerous, or move.It only takes one hit at speed to do serious damage. There are only 2 rocks in the Bay I'm on, & my wife managed to hit one with the SS Minnow, at speed. I parted the boat out & chopped the hull up with a chainsaw & took it to the dump.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--

Edchris- Great advice thank you. I agree I need to get in touch with other cat sailors and start there by getting out on the boats. As for my physique I would say somewhere between the two... I enjoy eating and barley sodas every now and then however I am still able to lift a railroad tie solo and walk it the length of a football field so I am not in horrible shape (tested this last weekend on some home improvement). However PLEASE don't ask me to run a mile... EVER.
Yes the boards would be tough as when in NC the sound has shifting bars constantly to that is an issue until you are in what is known to be deeper water for example the channel or ocean side off shore.

If all else fails and you want wallet friendly?......I know there are faster, better looking, modern boats but.... Hobie 16, solo the crap out of it and occasionally take one or two people out.... It will be a slug with 400#+ on it but there's no danger of not being able to right it, not finding parts or even selling it after a couple years when you go for the bigger boat and getting your money back out of it. Myself @ 200# the H16 is a blast and a rocket ship in 12-15kts with less than 250lbs on it, simple, super easy, tough and cheap (relatively) to repair if you crash.
Don't know about your area but i've bought a couple really nice solid H16's for under a grand including a trailer. Great beginner cat that are fast and in current production, theres a HUGE used market as well. Takes several months to find a jem though and usually involves a 3-5 hour drive each way. On the plus side you can keep the 16 for solo days and buy a bigger 18-20 footer when you've got crew so you have two boats ;)
Try out several boats in your area and see whats good, priced right and others near you sail.
Keep in mind the size of the mast, trailering and if you'll have help setting the boat up every time. 18+ foot boats have big heavy tall masts that i'd hate to even think of raising and lowering alone ( or spending an extra hour before and after sailing solo on rigging, gin poles, mast stands ect ect ) If you can store a boat near the water mast up most of the time its a non issue. Go to regattas when they pop up, great place to see all kinds of neat boats!

Here's my H16, buddies H20 and a new Hobie getaway all side by side for a basic size comparison.

Watch this:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW5TFeiBSgc

Can you go that fast in flip flops without a motor??!!



Edited by fxloop on Jan 03, 2015 - 01:00 AM.

--
Tim Grover
1996 Hobie Miracle 20
Two Hobie 14's
1983 G-Cat Restored
Memphis TN / North Mississippi
--

I've owned a P16, P18 and now a P19. The P16 is going to be a dog at over 400 lbs and with family on board an 18 will give you much more room. If solo is important to you go with a P16. An H16 will be faster, but I believe the P16 with its more buoyant hulls will be more forgiving overall. Parts have never been a problem as long as you buy a decent boat. Take a beach cat person with you to if at all possible. The P16 has a reefpoint as opposed to the P18 and P19 although adding one is fairly simple. I learned on a P16 and only once did I wish I had less sail area in a 30 knot blow and 9 foot seas. When I decide to buy a boat, I search craigslist, etc daily and spent up to a few months looking (Southern Cal area). I drove from Los Angeles to Lake Tahoe for the P19.

A nice thing about the old cats is you can always find ones in good shape if you're willing to look and perhaps travel. Duane bought his P18 for $400 and the sails are bright and crisp with colored gelcoat still on the bottom! Old boats depreciate slowly if at all as long as they are maintained, meaning you can sell them for what you paid.

Buy the smaller, lighter, simpler, easier righting 16 and after a couple of seasons, step up. I found the P18 to be a larger version of the P16, but it seemed more sensitive to tacking as I remember. I only kept the 18 for two years before buying the 19. The 19 is a handful solo at times, but I love its performance in ocean conditions. With rotating centerboards you stand a good chance of taking minimal damage from a strike and its aspect ratio is short and fat compared to daggerboards. With a large capacity righting bag, I can bring the boat back no problem.