But Boy was I having fun! HA
Guys: Thanks for all the help thus far.
Conditions:
Air Temp 96, Wind during first session 14, and Wind during second session: 17 w/ gusts to 22. High pressure all day with wind shifting direction 100 degrees in about 1 hour time—the whole time we were on the water during second sail.
I got to the boat launch at 9 and my helper and I got in the boat in the water at 11. We sailed around for an hour, came in and had lunch.

We got back in the water at a few minutes past noon and sailed around for a while. Although water had only 1’ waves near shore out further in the Chesapeake just north of the tallest span of the Chesapeake Bay Bridge, waves were 3’ with slight white caps. No problems aside from the fact the jib sheet was slightly frayed after being dragged via towing the boat and the sheath was coming undone, blocks were adding to the line coming apart. I tried various sail trims going different directions to determine optimal sail trims. We headed north towards the Magothy River about ½ mile from shore and I noticed the wind picking up, and gusting. The wind shifted from SE to NW pretty fast and as we approached the Magothy wind was ripping pretty good straight down the river out into the Bay. I was playing the gusts very good turning upwind upon noticing dark water coming at us. We were doing well, then without warning, we went over. My first scary thought was that mast was going to sink as I had forgotten to tie the small light weight plastic inner tube to the top of the mast (insurance) as I had done in the past. I did however seal the mast so now was the test to see if mast floated. We got up on the bottom hull and I deployed the righting line that was fashioned in a loop with blocks underneath the tramp. We tugged and the boat flipped up. And then, flipped over again. The boat tramp was facing the wind with the sail leeward. Now comes the fun part:


We had difficulty getting the boat back up. In one instance both hulls shot straight up as we were too far back on the hull. My crew was getting burned out and I realized I had one last chance to get the boat up before calling for help. Being blown out into the middle of the Chesapeake, we were forced to do a ballet dance on the hull (teeter totter) to get the right balance to swing the boat into the wind. Finally, with a lot of finesse with foot movement the boat turned and we were able to pull up the boat. This time I made sure to grab the lower hull to keep it from going over again as I knew this was our only chance. (I didn’t even consider using my righting pole…) After about 30 minutes from capsize we got the boat up. Once up and on the tramp, I assessed our situation: We lost all our drinking water, mate lost $200 sunglasses, I lost my ball cap, boom cap came off and was hanging down, pin still there, ( I suppose that happened when we both slide down the tramp onto the sail etc.)

While I held the tiller I asked my mate to tie the boom to the mast. This is when I realized he so lacked any mechanical ability and was not much help. He knew not one term and seemed to forget terms. I was teaching a little during first session with him only dealing with the jib sheet-- one line. I ended up getting the mast tied up and just so happened we were now heading south back towards the bridge and towards our landing spot. By this time we were tired, dehydrated etc. Mate was glad to be back on the boat but his first statement... we need to head back in! Apprehensive. I was enjoying the day! And knew we had at least one tack to put us on final course for beach.

The water cooled me a tad. We got up to near where our landing spot was and I needed to tack—after about 8 or 9 attempts the boat wouldn’t tack. This was due mostly to the fact that the jib sheet had come apart and was getting hung up in the block. Sensing we were in danger, my mate said: we better call the Coast Guard. He started to wave at a boat nearly 3 miles away. I told him we were OK etc. to calm him. I decided to get the CG on the radio, to cure his fears a tad, plus at least alert them that we might be having problems etc. The bridge, waves and being the only ones out there except for freighters and coal barges, with the threat of capsizing again probably added to his apprehension. It took 5 minutes or so then I heard CG asking other boats to come to our aid? By this time we were 200 yards downwind from the Bay Bridge. I didn’t want to get underneath the bridge, yet couldn’t tack. Waves were now 3-4’ wind was gusting. Jib was not helping, not being able to trim it correctly. So I made the decision to bear off away from the wind to change direction. (I did this as I didn’t want to be upwind from the bridge in the event of capsizing.) The sail swung around and nearly knocked my mate off the boat! Now were heading directly for the beach where the put in was. My mate was now relieved that he could see we were heading in.

This leg was pretty enjoyable for me as we were just sailing… sun was out, yet I was pretty thirsty. When we got 40 yards off shore from the take-out the wind put us in irons, between to rock jetties 50 ft. apart. I attempted to tack but had problems… I said, well the only thing we haven’t done yet was PADDLE THE BOAT! He immediately grabbed the paddle and took some strokes then when were within swimming distance he jumped into the water and towed the boat to shore via swimming! Boy he was so anxious to get his feet on the ground! It took another persons’ help to push the boat out of the water as both my mate and I were pretty exhausted.
I looked down and for the first time notice my small toe—cocked out 90 degrees, a definite break as later revealed via x-ray. Weird there was little pain…that I didn’t notice. Perhaps I was hurting more elsewhere for knocks and bruises. We were out of the water at 3 pm. Fortunately the wind was directly in line with the ramp making getting the sail unhooked without moving the boat. A real treat.
Overall I pretty much accomplished everything I wanted to do with this boat except trying to right the boat myself, which I’ve decided will not happen. It's fun to sail, but there's just waaaay too much work for as little please IMHO.


Here’s what I might have done:
1. Make sure all personal items are Totally secured.
2. Never sail with frayed sheeting lines, especially ones that go through ratcheting blocks or cleats etc.
3. Know your mate. (I met this person at the beach and he sailed with me during second splash, seemed OK. I really needed him for his weight in righting the boat. Without him, I think it would have been impossible for me to right the boat by myself, even with the righting pole I made.)
4. Don’t rely on CG. Here, they summoned other boaters to help us? Besides, I can’t think of how another boat could have helped as if towed while the sail was up may have caused us to capsize? I did make the call that we were OK and were heading back in. Life Guard in ATV came up to us and asked us what the heck we were doing out there, smiling. I said: just having fun!
5. Wear booties to protect toes and help grip standing on hull in the event of capsize. Hull was like standing on ice.
6. Have someone with you to help right the boat, especially when you are in open bay or ocean.

7. I didn’t have on a long sleeve shirt and my arms got fried. Boy it was a hot dry day. Losing the hat cost more sunburn on my face especially since I forgot to use sunblock… which I usually never forget.
We got everything packed up and met at 7-11 for beverages, slurping on water, slurpies I told my mate that we were totally experienced now: capsizing, breaking boat, hobbling back in, getting hurt etc. I asked: Would you go again. He said: “Any time, I’m down here several days a week just let me know.” Not sure if he was telling the truth. I probably won’t ever find out as I’m done sailing this boat, I think.


Hobie 18
Two person boat, possible two cat trax wheels for ground handling, no so effective rudders, nice boat for putting up Friday night, sailing Sat and Sun with take down Sun night. Labor intensive for one person, to put up and take down and sail in one day especially if injured and tired from capsizing. Good boat for mast up storage on beach. A forgiving boat at wind @ 15 and unpredictable as far as capsize @ 17+ with gusts in 20’s. Tracks pretty good. Not as wet as I thought it would be. Takes up lots of room in driveway.


Thanks for all the help guys. Hope you enjoyed following along. I’m selling the boat as I think I’m going to try a WAVE, once this one is gone and when my toe heals—4 weeks or so. I’ll post a classified soon or just PM me if you want to buy this one. Its battle tested! New boom end cap is on the way. OH by the way: mast floated, and hulls had no water in them. Pretty amazing since it was on its side for a while. It’s a real sturdy boat. Gelcoat is still shinny on interior hulls.

If you have any tips, please leave them. It's all about team work and I'm glad thebeachcat team has helped. Much appreciated. Believe me. You made it much easier.

Thanks again.

Goodsailing!

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

goodsailng, please:
- get a gopro, this community deserves it
- test the Wave before you buy. We enjoy your posts but we would rather avoid enthropy



Edited by Andinista on Jun 18, 2015 - 06:31 PM.

Also, investigate how to refine your tacking and gybing, it's not just your H18, all cats are harder to tack than monohulls. You can backwind the jib, turn backwards, ease your mainsheet. Going downwind in strong wind, or for a softer gybe: sheet in all the way



Edited by Andinista on Jun 18, 2015 - 07:32 PM.

Aw, that is a shame. It actually sounds like a couple of experiences I had when I first got my Nacra 5.2. Now you understand why the guys on here tend to be super finicky about safety and rechecking things. Simple problems on the shore turn into huge issues on the water. On top of that start off in the ocean isn't the most forgiving environment. Too bad about the toe, other than that you could have laughed all this off. I always wear shoes and either wetsuit bottoms or knickers that cover the knees. Grip is important and i am forever banging toes and knees. And never bring your expensive sunglasses or good hat! I buy mine by the carton full off of ebay for about $2 a pair. My wife managed to lose a $400 pair of bifocals after I warned her about that.

The tacking issues are normal, there is a definite technique, illustrated very nicely by Rick White in his videos. Basically you sit on the aft windward corner until the last second and then move across and to the front corner while allowing the jib to backwind slightly. Release the 2 ft of main sheet as you pass through the wind and the jib once you are though and you are good. Waiting until you are at least head to wind before you move is important because you want the boat to pivot mostly on that lee rudder and dagger. If you go to soon you will lose momentum and blow it, if you go too late the wind will catch your mainsail on the other side and you will have to run to keep it from dumping. Truthfully it isn't that complicated as that but those are the issues. Tacking is one of the hardest things to do on a cat. Like I said the Rick White videos are a little hokey but contain a lot of good info.

Having a good crew when learning is also important, but almost never seems to happen. I always give a canned speech ala Tommy Lee Jones in Firebirds before we go out. "In case we capsize, it will happen fast until that mast hits the water then it will go into slow motion. Try to slide under the boom or jump aft away from the sail . If you need to fall into the sail wait until the sail hits the water and fall flat onto it, not through. If you fall off, stay where you are, I will come back to get you. Etc Etc." After sailing for a few years I can handle all the controls myself but at that start having a good jib/daggerboard person is a must. Managing the helm and mainsheet is more than enough trouble for one person.

In the learning phase a wave may be a good option for you, but just be ready that you will probably want to get into something faster very quickly.

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Quote

goodsailng, please:
- get a GoPro, this community deserves it
- test the Wave before you buy. We enjoy your posts but we would rather avoid enthropy

I've watch many gopro sailing videos and basically I don't think any camera angle would capture the: excitement, intrepidation, fear, boredom, indecision, experimentation, fury, joy, enjoyment etc., as what words might paint an appropriate picture. Lets face reality, once you raise a flag pole with a sheet attached on a windy day to a perfect good solid life raft, which the hulls and tramp of a Hobie cat are, basically, you've entered the realm of enthropy. And, knowing you'll no doubt end up on a life raft prior to calling or waving for help, is indeed a comforting thought. Strike "fear" from the paragraph. Hey, we're sailing a life raft.

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

Sounds like a great day sailing. You will hate a Wave. Get some Keen H2s for shoes. Would the jib not furl?

--
'82 Super Cat 15
Hull #315
Virginia
Previously owned: '70 H14, '79 H16, '68 Sailmaster 26, '85 H14T
--

Quote

Would the jib not furl?

The jib sheet came unraveled and got hung up in the jib block so jib couldn't be trimmed properly for tacking. We were tacking with no problem up until the line cratered. I'm replacing the jib sheet and righting line. I'm going with over the hull for righting as getting higher reach would help pull it over. IMHO. Will only sail this boat now with crew to aid in riighting.
I'm looking at wave youtube videos and it looks you have just as much fun in a wave as this 18, and could take it out in higher winds. The 18 seems unpredictable when it's gusting above 20. Wave could be easier righting solo.

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

I got the boom end cap and new gooseneck pin installed. $65 in parts... Orthopedic Surgeon said I might take it easy for a while as the toe heals, but dang I want back out there!

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

You will get tired of the Wave real quick. I did!!! I then bought a Nacra SL 16 and LOVED IT!!!! It is a youth racing cat and real fast. You can sail it single handed!! No problem for a man to right it alone.

Mine is for sale on here. Take a look at it. 2007 Nacra SL 16.

Just a thought.

BTW .....I'm also from the Baltimore-Washington area. Born and raised. Now living in Oklahoma.

--
Bonnie

Nacra SL 16
Hobie Wave
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Sir, you are giving up on the H18 in haste. The source of your problems can be found in a good mirror.

--
'life is too short to drink cheap beer'
--

I sold the boat today. I looked in the mirror and saw an older guy who thought he was a kid. HA... I'm considering options as my toe heals. Look, an ideal boat for me is one I can sail myself, bigger than laser, that can be trailered to and from the water and rigged in no time. That can be righted easily solo. I'll defer to the other thread about other than H18 boats to consider.

Thanks for all the help with this one as this was the final splash.

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

Keep us posted on the next fail, it doesn't get much easier than catamarans. Seek some instruction, without it, there is no 'RIGHT' boat.

--
'life is too short to drink cheap beer'
--

Quote

Keep us posted on the next fail, it doesn't get much easier than catamarans. Seek some instruction, without it, there is no 'RIGHT' boat.

Not really a fail. I know pretty much all I want to know about a Hobie 18 from experience in refurbishing one and sailing one, and with the help here from lots of great people I feel confident about sailing any cat now. The search is on for a lighter weight, solo cat.

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

I dumped my Hobie 18 this weekend as well. I was driving from the wire, had a 12 yo passenger who was hiking out on the wire. Winds were 20 with gusts to 30, and I was out with a buddy on his Hobie FX, and another buddy on his F-27 corsair. We were SCREAMING across he lake, and was almost back to the cove when, while flying the hull, we were hit by a strong(er) gust and over she went. Kid didn't give me enough weight to get it back upright, so I got the (adult) crewman from the FX and we got her up.

Sailed her into the cove and made myself a couple of Hobie Brews to help with the aches and pains from my Hobie bruises.

Some unsolicited advice:

1. Don't bash the Coast Guard. You were on a sailboat, no indication that your life/limb were in danger, and they were a long way away from you. I believe the closest rescue station would have been Station Cape Charles 15-30 miles north of you. They may or may not have launched, but issuing a UMIB (Urgent Marine Information Broadcast) asking anyone who is already in the area to help is a good idea. Trust me, in areas with lots of recreational boaters, they can't launch for every small boat sailor who gets knocked over. But they will launch if they get word that you are actually IN trouble.

2. Don't sail small boats like Hobies alone in moderate (or above) weather, or that far from shore.

Hobie 18's are amazingly capable boats for their size. The only reason I was knocked over is because I was driving it on the edge before that gust hit. This is only the 4th time I've knocked her over, and I sail her pretty hard.

Good luck!

--
Shawn

Current: H18 (Bosun's Toy), Buccaner 272 (No Priorities)

Past: Prindle 18 (EssVee)

Previous life: 110' Island Class Patrol Boat
47' Motor Life Boat
44' Motor Life Boat
41' Utility Boat
30' Surf Rescue Boat
Various other smaller rescue boats
--

Good sailing,
I agree it wasn't a fail. But it isn't an older guy thing either. You started on a big boat teaching yourself in difficult conditions. And had some bad luck/inexperience get you at the wrong time. Find a nice hobie 16 or other 16 footer and try it again on some flat water. You will be ready for big guy very quickly. Hardest thing to learn is when it's a bad time to go, especially when it's blowing. You can't really schedules sailing, you go when the conditions dictate not the other way around. I went out for my first real sail this year last weekend (yes I'm super late, life happens) in too much wind to get reoriented to my boat. I had a fun time and all went well but it could have been ugly. I blew so many tacks I was getting frustrated, but I'm getting back into form. Everything held together solidly which I attribute to triple checking everything on shore but I also found a few glitches in my traveller that I need to correct. It's always an evolution of tweaking the boat, learning and perfecting skills and learning your limits. Hope you get back on the water soon.

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Good points on the Coast Guard. Didn't really need to make a call, but to appease my crew, plus allow some heads up that we might need help especially if the turn down wind didn't go as planned, as we probably wouldn't have been able to self right, with all the excitement going on. We blew tacks as we didn't really have a jib sheet as it was hung up in the block due to coming apart. I'm considering smaller cat. The newer Nacra's 460 look pretty interesting. Hobie Getaway?

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

Quote

Seek some instruction, without it, there is no 'RIGHT' boat.

Sailing is not that difficult. It's the matter of learning the boat mostly, if you already know how to sail.

Although not a cat, here's is the right boat for around here. You can sail it, row it, camp in it, motor it etc. You don't need beach wheels as you can use boat ramp and row to the sailing area. You can put the sail up or down while on the water. You can go places. Not sure about capsizing and righting LOL

Most forget that there is hardly any public beach areas to launch cats. I believe there are only 2 or 3 on the entire Chesapeake Bay. Annapolis, supposed sailing capitol of the world has only one beach launch site. (States collect fees from motor boats hence there are more motor boat ramps than there are places to put a dinghy in. )

See 1:30 or so.. very cool boat..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB_CssFCMEs

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

goodsailing

Most forget that there is hardly any public beach areas to launch cats. I believe there are only 2 or 3 on the entire Chesapeake Bay. Annapolis, supposed sailing capitol of the world has only one beach launch site.

Would that be Sandy Point?


I seem to remember that Elk Neck, Gun Powder Falls, St, Mary's, and a few other allowed beach launching..is this no more?

Also, Rocky Point; that is part of the Baltimore Park system, allows beach launching...

Let me now if this has changed...

--
John Schwartz
Ventura, CA
--

Quote

Let me now if this has changed...

Yes Sandy Point
Rocky Point: a sailing club owns the beach there so it is not public. Fact it's roped off. So only the two boat ramps are available there, one of which I use for the Laser. You couldn't take a cat out of the ramp, trees, too narrow.
As for the others, when they say SMALL BOAT LAUNCH, that usually means: kayaks/ car toppers as the parking lots for most of these places don't allow boat trailers. Plus beach is usually bordered by rocks, trees etc that you couldn't get the cat through. At north beach just above Baltimore, I had to carry my kayak from the parking lot, past picknic tables and down rock jetti just to get in the water... I'm telling you, unless you have private property with a lift or beach, you're not going sailing and in some cases, kayaking. (Are they still classifying standup paddle boards as "vessels,") With what the state is doing to water and even air for flying: You'll be back on a bicycle in a few years) No access means: no fun.


Elk Neck: Canoes and kayaks only. Boats
must be hand-carried approximately 500 feet to the launch area, to the right of the swim
area. Boats must remain outside of the swim area. Please go online for more
information about fees: www.dnr.maryland.gov/publiclands/oc.asp



Edited by goodsailing on Jul 07, 2015 - 07:22 PM.

--
Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

goodsailing

Yes Sandy Point

Rocky Point: a sailing club owns the beach there so it is not public.

Sandy Point is where I had my first catamaran ride.... showed up there one day with my Force 5, got an invitation from a Hobie sailor needing a crew for a regatta and it was downhill from there...

Guess things have changed....

What does it cost to join the club? Sometimes membership does have it benefits... that is if you could leave your boat there with the mast up ready to go at any time... may be worth the scheckles... I seem to remember that area being a little protected too... may be good for beginner to cut their teeth.

goodsailing

With what the state is doing...... and even air for flying

Are you a pilot? You know you can still fly in and around the DC SFRA... just take the FAA course so you know the rules or file an IFR plan... easy peasy...

--
John Schwartz
Ventura, CA
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Quote

may be good for beginner to cut their teeth

So after you cut your teeth in the Chesapeake where do you take your boat? Not sure what you are speaking about. Are you talking about jumping the H18 in surf water?


I'm from the day when you could get in the plane fly across DC without talking to anyone. Avgas $.90/gal. When you file, you're taken to Bum F Egypt, not where you want to go.
Freedoms since narrowed.
$1200 per year for mast up storage at Podickory Marina near North of Annapolis. Not what I want to pay. Hell the boat only cost me $400! But it's now on to another sailboat..or perhaps finishing the boat in the garage that would suit my sailing needs. (I'm nearing completing the main hull and will start thinking of cross beams for alma, and sail plan soon. Steel toed boots of course in the work area!



Edited by goodsailing on Jul 09, 2015 - 01:00 PM.

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Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--

goodsailing

I'm from the day when you could get in the plane fly across DC without talking to anyone. Avgas $.90/gal. When you file, you're taken to Bum F Egypt, not where you want to go.

So you taught Orville and Wilbert how to fly?

--
John Schwartz
Ventura, CA
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Quote

So you taught Orville and Wilbert how to fly?

Funny...
Oh boy. Orville and Wilbert were the first pilots and they taught themselves how to fly.

And prices for fuel then was: 15.5 CENTS/ gal
100LL Avgas in the late 60's was under a $1. You could buy a brand new Datsun, now Nissan ,new for $1999.00.
Auto gas before (the current President--not sure why it came up with asterisks ****) was $1.50 (You may remember that one.. .

The cool thing about getting old is that you can tell all the youngins how cheap things use to be. New Nacra 460 over $10K; Yikes.



Edited by goodsailing on Jul 09, 2015 - 07:10 PM.

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Goodsailing

Laser-Standard Rig (Sold 6/15)
H18 (Sold 7/15)
Building 19' Tacking Outrigger
Balt-Wash Area
--