BeachCat trailering & tongue weight

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btrouse

Rank: Lubber

Registered: Aug 19, 2009

Last visit: Dec 07, 2009

Posts: 7
Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 11:34 AM

This is probably a silly question, but what do you guys usually setup for tongue weight?

I'm making my first long haul (with a hobie 18) from the UP of MI to the east coast of FL. I'm planning to leave in a week, and I have already serviced the tires, wheel bearings, lights, setup some reflectors and put on a set of fenders. My only question remaining is regarding weight distribution.

I'm a bit of a towing noob, but I was thinking that too little tongue weight was supposed to promote trailer sway. So that is to be avoided at all costs, but too much tongue weight is supposed to affect he weight distribution of the tow vehicle and cause the front (steering) wheels to "lift".

I thought I recall people saying around 15% of trailer weight is a good estimate. I just wanted to check with others here on this (incredibly helpful) forum on what you guys usually use.

Maybe its not that important, but it would seem to me that with such a large wind profile and so little total weight that the tongue weight in the driveway might be a bit different than when actually traveling down the road at 60 mph. I think the aerodynamic drag force would make the tongue want to lift, right?

Maybe its not that important, but I was just hoping for a few thoughts / comments / suggestions.

Thanks guys,
Brandon
rpiper138

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Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 02:56 PM

I trailered a Nacra 5.5 from Michigan to Dallas behind a Ram 1500 pickup. With this configuration, the more tongue weight, the better. The class 4 hitch will actually support more weight than the boat and trailer combined and the payload of the truck far outweighs the weight capacity (1000 lb tongue weight) of the hitch.

Unless you are towing with a Smart car or other golf cart it shouldn't be an issue. Just make sure that there is enough weight forward to avoid trailer sway. The front end of the tow vehicle isn't likely to get light unless you are towing a very big cat (X-40) with a very small car.
smfinley

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Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 06:13 PM

I usually put as much tongue weight as I can but still lift the tongue when connecting to my car without being to difficult. So probably around 100 pounds.

I think my H16 had less then that but I ran into the problem with axle location on the trailer. By the time I got the boat far enough forward to have a heavy tongue the hulls were to close to my vehicle.

Unless you have a very small car I don't think you can really get to much tongue weight to impact front tire contact.

--
Scott,
‘92 H18 w/SX wings
‘95 Hobie Funseeker 12 (Holder 12)
‘96/‘01/‘14 Hobie Waves
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HULLFLYER

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Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 08:15 PM

Normal rule of thumb according to most towing guides is 10-15% of the total weight of the trailer including load
HULLFLYER

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Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 08:19 PM

[You can have to much tounge weight but not normally with out beach cat and trailer. If you are towing a heavy load and have an excessive amount of tounge weight it will make the car or tow vehicle very "light" in the front which can cause steering problems.quote=smfinley]I usually put as much tongue weight as I can but still lift the tongue when connecting to my car without being to difficult. So probably around 100 pounds.

I think my H16 had less then that but I ran into the problem with axle location on the trailer. By the time I got the boat far enough forward to have a heavy tongue the hulls were to close to my vehicle.

Unless you have a very small car I don't think you can really get to much tongue weight to impact front tire contact.[/quote]
btrouse

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Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 09:41 PM

I guess I should have mentioned the issue about a really small car. It's not a "smart car" but rather its a Saturn! I'm just joking, I actually like my Saturn quite a bit, its a machine designed to get 38 mpg and its made from tupperware so it can never rust! But unfortunately its not much of a tow vehicle. The total curb weight is 2300 lbs and it does have a class 1 towing rating.

To give a little perspective, when I installed the receiver, it came with a backing plate and it mounted through 3 layers of sheet metal on the unibody.

So I agree that too much tongue weight usually never hurts when your vehicle is designed for it, but in this case I'm trying not to over estimate.
DamonLinkous

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Posted: Dec 06, 2009 - 10:11 PM

Wind resistance is a bigger issue than weight when towing a beachcat since the boat is much wider than the car.

With a lightweight tow vehicle that doesn't have "tow package" items like an transmission cooler and larger radiator, keep your max speed down, especially in hilly areas. It would be worth your while to install a real temp gauge before the trip if your car just has a warning light.

As far as the tongue weight, just make sure you can still pick up the tongue with the boat fully road ready.

--
Damon Linkous
1992 Hobie 18
Memphis, TN

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Wolfman

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 12:06 AM

I tow my Nacra 5.2 with a 4 cylinder GMC tracker, without a problem. Never had a problem with overheating but I haven't towed through significant hills.

For a significant trip I would go with Damon's advice and get a temp gauge installed if you don't have one (I have one). Overheating your car will ruin your whole day (can you say head gasket replacement). It probably won't be a problem but better spend $50 for the gauge so you know rather than the $2000 bill later.

I push my boat as far forward as possible without interfering with turning, and so I can still lift it onto my tongue. Make sure you have lots of compression straps around the hulls to keep them in place. I use 3-4 on each side with a couple on the cross bars to keep the boat from moving front or back. I definitely prefer the buckle type compression straps used for canoe`s like these ones:

http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442630915&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302700901&bmUID=1260162301306

over the hook and ratchet type. These simply never loosen and cannot come undone. I've had a few bad experiences with the ratchet type straps.

D.

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Rider_55

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 11:22 AM

I tow my P18 with a 1.8L automatic Pontiac Vibe. Have done several hundred miles at a time at 70+ mph with no problems in August in the south. I have installed an aftermarket transmission cooler to help prevent trans. damage, but in this weather you probably wouldn't see any benefit from it. To increase tongue weight without shoving the boat forward I bolted a large storage box to the trailer in which I carry all my stays, sheets, blocks, hardware, and life jackets. I estimate the tongue weight to be between 100-150 pounds.
turtlecat

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 12:15 PM

just echoing the sentiments stated and adding a few. I've driven about 1200 miles one way when I first bought my N6.0. Simply loaded the weight more forward, and lashed her down well. I do use straps for most travel, but I do insist on using rope for insurance, especially for the mast. Other towing tid bits, that I enjoy that you aren't really asking for is being able to see your side marker lights at night. I slanted the front side markers on a 45deg. to help give me peace of mind when towing at night. Our boats are very light and tow easily, but its the width and length (mast) gets us into the most trouble!
btrouse

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 01:19 PM

speaking of innovative markers and tail lights, the previous owner of my boat/trailer setup had fabricated an interesting set of trailer lights.

The tail lights are affixed to long piece of square aluminum conduit. The conduit is about 6' long by 3/4" x 3/4" square. The square conduit is then mounted to the rudder pintles. An electrical connector between the trailer and the light bar allows you to remove the lights completely. The idea is then that the lights are more viable as you drive down the road. Then when you get to launching the boat they never get dunked in the salt water.

I haven't done any longevity or durability testing yet, but I think the design at least warrants the title of "innovative"
MN3

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 01:19 PM

QuoteI use 3-4 on each side with a couple on the cross bars to keep the boat from moving front or back.

You use 10 straps to secure your cat to your trailer?
lawrencer2003

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 01:35 PM

You are over thinking this. Move the cat and mast forward and you will be fine.

My friends and I have been dragging cats around for year behind 4 cylinder cars some in pretty nasty shape.

More important to:
1) Make sure your lights work
2) Make sure your tires and bearings are in good shape, and that you have a spare and tools.
3) Make sure you car is in good shape.
4) lock the once the tongue is engaged on the ball, lock in place.
5) Use your safety chains.
6) Get the heck out of dodge before the snow hits!
P.M.

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 02:10 PM

QuoteI've driven about 1200 miles one way when I first bought my N6.0. Simply loaded the weight more forward, and lashed her down well.

A word of caution, on boats like these, if you don't have cradles on the front supports, you run the risk of crushing the hulls if they are not positioned bulkhead over a roller. The front supports carry most of the weight.

--
Philip
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MN3

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 02:56 PM

QuoteThe front supports carry most of the weight.

The front (as in the rollers closest to the tounge or the front of the cat)?

What if the cat is sterns to the tounge? does this change anything?

edited by: andrewscott, Dec 07, 2009 - 02:57 PM
P.M.

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 03:17 PM

Sure it does. . . the cat, not the trailer, most of the weight is over the front beam (of the boat).

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Philip
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Wolfman

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 03:31 PM

Yep I use 10 supports for my cat to the trailer and a few more for the mast. Overkill?

--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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turbohobo

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 03:49 PM

No matter which way you trailer your cat, it is recommended that the weight factor be shifted toward the trailer tongue. In other words, with cat and trailer detached from tow vehicle, the trailer tongue will drop onto the ground due to the weight factor. If the rear of the trailer wants to drop instead, lifting the trailer tongue into the air, this is a serious issue that needs to be addressed immediately. If rolling the cat forward does not resolve issue, remove cat from trailer and move the crossbars forward if possible. If unable to move crossbars check to see if axle can be moved back, if unable to move axle check to see if sailbox can be moved forward, if no sailbox buy RubberMaid box and attach to trailer tongue for stowing. Use whatever means to make sure weight is forward, not only does weight-forward dampen trailer sway, it's also a safety issue.
Sometimes in all the fuss of getting ready to go sailing, hitching the trailer, attaching the safety chains, checking the lash-down straps, packing sails, checking for PFD's, checking bearing buddies, checking trailer lights, checking all shrouds are good, loading the kids, making sure you have everything packed and loaded, you forget to drop the ball lock lever, also known as the coupler lock. Now imagine headed down the road and with the first bump the trailer tongue lifts into the air........ I shudder at the thought.
So, as mentioned in above posts, weight forward, should be able to lift trailer tongue easily to maneuver trailer onto hitch, if rear shocks bottom out, too much weight, adjust accordingly.

Turbo
MN3

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 03:49 PM

QuoteYep I use 10 supports for my cat to the trailer and a few more for the mast. Overkill?

whatever you feel is correct.. .i dont know your drive, driving, etc... but that takes more time to rig...

i use 1 ratchet (port bow) and 1 line (star bow) and 1 line on the rear beam to the trailer (straight down)
MN3

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Posted: Dec 07, 2009 - 03:51 PM

QuoteSure it does. . . the cat, not the trailer, most of the weight is over the front beam (of the boat).

I have never seen a cat fail on the bows (personally), i have seen pics with it happen in the winter with snow weight ... i think i want double rollers on my trailer as i can't use 4 cradles..