Cool, I was just kidding, I know we have troups here (my wife does Brownies, a younger girlscout type organization). Just a subtle reference to the X-box generation and some of the experiences I've had working up north near polar bear country.
Hey I just scored 12 feet of 3/8" 303 Stainless Round bar. Anyone interested in some uber strong rudder pins?
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Hard start to the season
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Posted: May 27, 2010 - 05:43 PM
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Posted: May 29, 2010 - 09:56 PM
Are the pins that thick Dave? I'll have to measure mine tomorrow. I know they are solid stainless. Murryas sells a few different models of them, the solid SS are by far the most expensive. I had my entire rudder system apart over the winter, just put them all back together with new pivmatic, pull down lines, & bungees. I didn't think the pins were as big as 3/8", make sure they go into the gudgeon. You could always have the ends turned down to fit into the gudgeons. When I first read your story, I thought they would be pretty easy to make. The only wrinkle would be drilling the holes for the ringdings. It is a pretty damn small hole, drilled in a small diameter rod. I don't think you would be successful without a drill press & a good bit. You should be able to find a machine shop that could do it.
I'll measure mine tomorrow, & give you the specs.
It was hot here, but pretty windy, so I just had the little Invitation out for about 3 hours.
Went swimming once,& was trying something new,(trying to right it without getting off the boat). I ended up turtleing the damn thing near shore & stuck the mast in the mud. I was being blown onto a lee shore, so I had to right it & sail away with a big glob of crap stuck to the end of the mast. I sailed til the sail dried, then went in, dropped the sail & had to wash the top 2 feet.
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Posted: May 29, 2010 - 10:13 PM
Almost all rudder pins are 3/8" diameter except he H20 (and maybe a couple of the newer boats). I think the Murray's ones are actually hollow.
I have a drill press (and a whole garage of woodworking tools). Shouldn't be a problem drilling the hole, that and the alloy is 303, which is easier to cut and drill than 304.
I had the same problem on my lake with our old hobie 16, the mast is 28 feet long and the lake is only 8-10 feet deep. I haven't have that problem with the N 5.2 simply because the mast volume is large and I sealed the heck out of it.
When I was a kid I remember sticking the hobie mast over 6 feet into the muck. It took hours and hours to unstick, finally a ski boat got us out but we were scared the mast was going to break.
I haven't gotten to a post office yet but I should send your package off on Monday. We've been deluged here with record rain (I have about an inch of water in my basement). If you want a set I can probably cut them and send fire them into the box, not sure if I will have time to drill them.
D.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: May 30, 2010 - 10:47 AM
I stand corrected, it looks like you're in the rudder pin business!
I just went out & pulled one off. They are 3/8" x 10 1/4" long. Hole is drilled 1/8" from each end. They are solid round stock. Shows how reliable memory is at times, I would have bet beer that they were smaller than 3/8".
Sure, I'll take a couple of blanks as spares, never know when I might lose one. If the top ringding comes off, they would be sleeping with the fish pretty quick.
As long as you can get a tiny mark established, so as to start the hole without the bit wandering, you should be OK.
I don't have a decent drill press, but I can get my neighbor to drill them. He owns a tool & die making company, & get just about anything done with metal.
Thanks
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 12:04 AM
Hey thanks to everybody that has been helping this idiot, either directly, or with posted questions that I also needed to know the answers to. It was all worth it!
Now that everything has come up rosy, I'll tell my tale of MY first sail with my new-to-me boat. Oh, and my first attempts. I wanted to do inland, since there was no way for me to tell how long it had been since the thing had seen water...the poor guy I got it from never sailed it. I went over everything very carefully. It took me quite a bit of adjusting and tweaking before I was satisfied it was worth a try.
First was Clear Lake: No swimming for the girls with me that wanted to go swimming, no place for the girls that wanted to skim-board, and no beach to pull the boat up on to pick up and drop off girls. Did I mention it was just me and a bunch of girls? How does anyone sail this place? We hit Galveston and the boat stayed on the trailer.
So, someone mentions Lake Livingston. It looks great, with state parks and I?d heard of grassy shores where swimming is OK. It?s a drive, but here we go. I paid my $9.00 only to discover that there is a concrete wall all the way around the park and the swimming area is a ways from the boat ramp. AARRRRGG. To top it all off, the boat ramp and loading area was concrete too. It took the wife and 2 girls to hold the boat away while I raised the main. I figured I could get the jib up after we found a grassy spot somewhere. Got the main up, the ladies jumped on, and away we sailed. For about 300 yards anyways. About that time I decided to get a good pull on the mainsheet. The forestay turnbuckle (the BOLT, not the cable) parted with a bang, and the mast came down between us all. No one was injured, but all were a little freaked out.
No boats were around to help, so I sort of held the sail up sideways to get us some wind. It worked but the mast had fouled the tiller so we went in a circle, just a little closer to shore. Then the wind shifted and the sail blew on top of me, leaving 3 girls in bikinis perched on the tramp. In no time, we had 2 motor boats eager to help. I picked the one with the oldest Captain, thanked the other, and we were motored to the pier. The shame!
Somewhere on one of the older posts, I read ?buy new shrouds and forestay, just to be safe.? Lesson learned: I ordered one of everything that holds the mast up from The Sailboat Shop in Austin, and headed to Surfside Beach! Things went a whole lot better from then on. I met Collin, a Texas City Dike Yacht Club big-wig, his crew Jonathon, and a great guy named Curt, there with his daughter Karen. I had just guys with me so I didn?t care how bad it went, but nothing bad happened. The boat is different from the NACRA 5.2 and the Hobie 14 I sailed before (duh) so it?s going to be a learning curve, but the best sail of the weekend was the last one; with big Curt on the wire we did a ?Screaming Beam? and flew a hull for at least fifty yards. At no time did the lee bow show any sign of plowing under, unlike the NACRA which threatened me with a pitch-pole any time I started haulin.
Look for me this weekend at Surfside again. I?ll have a bunch of drunk Englishmen with me---the England / USA soccer game is on 9:00 am Saturday.
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Repairable P18
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 02:32 AM
My 5.2 is extremely sensitive to mast rake in this regard. One notch on the forestay is unsailable. Any power forces a sort of 'powerstall' where the power in the sail just forces the bows down, which stops the boat.
One notch back and the boat will sail fine until it picks up speed, at which point the bows dive, and it pitchpoles.
One more notch back and it sails perfectly.
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Rob
OKC
Pile of Nacra parts..
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 05:56 AM
ummm.... i've never been that close to a pitchpole on my 5.2 and i had the mast almost straight up, but i guess i'm pretty light and on a lake there are few waves to stick the bow in...............have pitchpoled my weta tri though..all the same i raked the mast on my 5.2 as far back as the forestay chainplate allowed...just aft...and nothing like on my friends h16 that is parked next to it on the beach -
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 09:06 AM
unless you know him, and this was a joke, it's completely unnecessary, inappropriate and bad form. no wonder your forstay jumped ship!
edited by: andrewscott, Jun 10, 2010 - 11:38 AM -
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 09:18 AM
Wow, what a rough start to the year/new boat.
Glad you survived, good lessons to learn / share
a couple points to reinforce:
dry rig your cat in your yard/driveway before you go sailing (for the first time). this will help reduce the chance of missing/wrong gear. This is true for when you purchase a new cat too (so the old owner can show you how to rig/and to make sure all the parts are there and working)
if your pfd isn't secured.. its gonna be a hindrance more than an asset. the first thing i do when i get wet is roll over (on my back) and make sure the pfd is zipped, buckled and cinch down all the straps to reduce its movement.
make sure your crew knows what to do in the event of a man-overboard, capsize, skipper overboard
Keep the faith, you will do fine!
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 10:37 AM
Reading this gave me a deja-vu moment. Here's my story summary:
-way too novice sailor and crew
-new boat
-too much wind (15-20kts)
-fun at first
-gust...fly hull...other hull completly under water
-dump main and sigh of relief
-start home...shift...gust.. dump me in water...hanging on to hull for dear life
-dump main from in water ... get back on boat
-notice deep gash on top of thumb
-drop main...sail to stranger's shore with jib
-knock on door and return 2 days later to retrieve boat
-boat looks like crime scene due to blood everywhere (thinking of new name for boat due to blood stains)
-counting ourselves lucky
Lots of good lessons learned.
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Gray Amick
Chapin, SC
'77 NACRA 5.2
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 11:40 AM
At first I didn't understand your post but I get it now. I've been posting in a couple of forum sites. The idiot I was referring to was me. I have a self-depreciating sense of humor, and like most cat sailors, I'm generaly a nice guy.
And to reply to the forestay issue, let me repeat that I checked eveything very carefully. All cable ends were inspected thoroughly and I masted the boat 3 times using the forestay and a winch! After getting back to shore, I looked the turnbuckle bolt over, and I cant believe it held at all...the amout of material that was not long-ago corroded was less than the size of the small bend on a standard paper clip. The idiot part was where I didn't just do the careful thing, and replace eveything regardless. If anyone else took my post wrong, I'm sorry I wasn't clear.
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Repairable P18
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 11:56 AM
I thought you were calling Wolfman an idiot (for his misfortunes) and i thought that was incredibly rude, so i called you a jerk.
I later felt my tone was a bit harsh (its not the first time i have spoken my mind, to later feel i may have been to hard on someone) and had gone back and removed the jerk part of my statement. So i also apologize for being a rude. -
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 12:04 PM
That sounds like wuite the adventure Dave! As Bob said above tie some loops in your righting line and use it as a ladder. When i sailed a 5.2 i would reach over the side and grab the footstraps and pull myself on the boat. Glad this story didnt have a bad ending like losing your main or someone getting hurt. Obviously youve learned alot from this experience and i bet it will never happen again!
Pirateboy....I guess you made the class last weekend. I stopped by for a bit but must of missed you. Saw a few prindles sailing when i stopped by. TCDYC is a great bunch!
This weekend should have a decent crowd down at Tenmile. Beach access6 surfside beach. Its ten miles from the 332 bridge to access 6. its just a little further down towards san luis pass then access 3 where the class was held.
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 12:42 PM
Well Dave I have been replacing parts these two weeks and get out of school(teacher) today and have been salivating waiting for tomorrow. Then I read your post. I think you have deflated me. Great to hear everything came out all right, and yes I will check all my replacements before I go out. Thanks for the reminder Also if your wife stays on as your crew she loves you.
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Nacra 5.2
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 12:45 PM
Andrew: I'm a sarcastic ba$tsrd, and what I say is taken the wrong way often. Someday I'll learn. I got no problem with you defending a bud. Maybe you'll do the same for me some day.
TC: I wish! The class was the same time as my daughter's graduation, so I had family in from everywhere for the weekend. I sure need a refresher, tho, so count me in for the next one. Date of?
If I can talk one of the guys into a long sail I'll see you at ten-mile. I'm attending a Stag party and we're staying at the motel behind Kity's Purple Cow.
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Repairable P18
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 01:02 PM
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 02:43 PM
He he, I've been called much worse things than an idiot. :) And to be honest I think I would have deserved it if that was what was meant, but glad to see everything was resolved.
I got a collapseable ladder from West marine and tied it off to my rear beam and strapped it up under my tramp for quick deployment. Should work fine for the wife, I think that she will be OK from here on it. I know she loves me, I'm a seriously hairy bugger and she has stayed with me for 20+ years now. ;)
Good advice on mast rake guys! I was actually struggling with that a bit because my new Shrouds (from Murray's) are shorter than the originals and I had to add a second adjuster on the forestay to make up the difference. I was going to go to 10 hole adjsters on the shrouds to correct the rake back to straight up, but now I'm thinking I should leave it raked. Especially with the extra power provided by the flat head main, wow what a beast!
Golfdad, don't be deflated, you are going to love your boat and it will treat you well. I just made the mistake of replacing ALL the rigging at once and taking her out for the first sail of the season in rediculous wind. Should have been patient and waited for a calmer day to try things out, but I was too excited.
I got out solo last weekend with just the main and light winds and worked out the kinks. I'm ready to rock and roll!
Oh I posted some photos of my boat on my album here http://www.thebeachcats.com/index.php?module=pictures&g2_itemId=74145 with jib block rigging and my homemade sideloaders. Not much different than Airborne's but more angles might clarify better. More to come.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 04:40 PM
I've been re-reading our horror-story posts, and a thought struck me. Someone who's never been sailling might come across this site and wonder "You guys do this for FUN?"
I can't wait to get my buddy who teases me about not having a REAL boat out on the water this weekend. He keeps asking why I don't have a motor, and when I point out the 30 ft tall motor, he just doesn't get it.
They said they got a few people out for their first cat ride at the sail clinic. Awesome! I know I was hooked after the first sail. It's worth all the headaches and danger when that hull lifts, and you're hanging straight out over the water with all the mainsheet you can pull. No gas, no oil, sure. No motor? Then tell me how the heck are we flyin across the water.
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Repairable P18
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Posted: Jun 10, 2010 - 05:18 PM
It's not for everyone.
neither is skydiving, scuba, lion taming, high wire walking, being shot out a cannon, etc.
but for us A type, adrenalin junkies, it is for us. -
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Posted: Jun 11, 2010 - 03:55 PM
Great Looking sail - Chip is the Man!!!!
fair winds....
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Gordon
Nacra 5.5SL
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