I just ordered all new standing rigging for my P-18 from Salty Dog Marine. All the wires they use for standing rigging is vinyl coated. I was a little concerned since I had read that the coating could trap water inside and cause corrosion, so I asked Salt Dog Marine if the vinyl coating should/could be stripped off the wires. This is the response I received (paraphrased to save space).
Salty dog wrote:
Steve,
We are not sure why you would want to strip the vinyl. In the case of the shrouds it protects your main sail and your crew when they are on the trapeze wires. You can use a sharp utility knife to strip the vinyl but we would advise against it.
After expressing more concerns about corrosion I received this message:
Salty dog wrote:
No. Corrosion in rigging only happens when you have two dissimilar metals. In the case of your rigging electrolysis (corrosion) will occur where the stainless steel rigging, and thimbles, are nicro pressed with compression sleeves that are nickel coated copper. Leave the vinyl on and rinse the rigging with fresh water when you are done sailing.
I replied with this:
Steve wrote:
I understand about galvanic corrosion (dissimilar metals) but SS hardware can also corrode other ways (pitting, stress corrosion cracking,etc)? Stainless Steel requires a thin oxide coating to develop on the surface to help protect against corrosion. It requires an oxygen supply for this to happen. If salt water was to displace the oxygen inside the vinyl coating the protective film would not be in place and corrosion would develop at an accelerated rate, and being covered it wouldn't be noticeable until a failure occurred. Also inside the coating the wires would be rubbing against each other and chafe which would also destroy the oxide coating. In fresh water application it shouldn't be such a problem. Hope this makes sense.
I am all ears if I have my facts wrong.
Thanks,
Steve
Salty dog wrote:
In 27 years of business sold a lot of rigging to salt water sailors and in 48 years of racing raced a number of times in salt water. Never had a wire break in the middle nor heard of a wire breaking in the middle from corrosion. A lot of broken end fittings. Could be wrong.
Also:
Look at it this way. None of the major manufacturers would leave the coating on if they thought the wire would fail. Hobie Cat especially is a target for every lawyer in the world. Further, chances are your boat is about 20 years old, based roughly on when they stopped making them,
and it probably has the original wires on it.
We recommend that you change the wires about every 6-7 years for salt water boats but I have been to many regattas where the old east and west coast boats (salt water) still had the original wires. Rinse the ends off with fresh water, go sailing.
Have a great night.
Salty Dog Marine
My hat goes off to Salty Dog Marine for taking the time and effort to address my concerns. Their answers make sense to me. I'll definitely be buying items from them again in the future! Just wanted to share this info with others beachcats owners. I hope it clears the air a little bit about the standing rigging coatings.
Thanks,
Steve
Standing rigging..coated or bare?
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Posted: Jul 27, 2010 - 12:15 PM
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Posted: Jul 27, 2010 - 12:42 PM
I have also had great service from Salty Dog Marine! 6-7 Years does seem like a long time although my first 1986 Hobie 16 had original rigging and I sailed it until I noticed my shrouds strands started to break.
edited by: fa1321, Jul 27, 2010 - 11:43 AM -
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Posted: Jul 27, 2010 - 11:51 PM
You know, I just today dismantled my poor '82 H14T. It had been struck by a tree that had been hit by lightning. All my rigging was still original :). And all of it was coated. This boat had been sailed for quite a few years in salt water, and during my possession back to fresh. Now 28 years is crazy to not replace rigging, but when I first got into sailing I was a "if it aint broke, it's not an issue" guy. After all that was way before internet..
Anyhow, the last few times that boat hit the water, it was in extreme wind, with several flips. The stress on the rigging had to be great. I guess the point is things may last a REALLY long time...but bad things will happen at some point if rigging isn't serviced. It's rolling the dice. For me, this boat just happened to be disposable. I'll miss her though! Oh! I've peter-pan'd before...I was glad for coated shrouds!
edited by: turtlecat, Jul 27, 2010 - 10:53 PM -
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 12:12 AM
I know a lot of people here will disagree with me but I do like the coated shrouds. I agree with Salty Dog that 99% of the problems will show at the connections before anywhere else. This is even true in fresh water. I sailed on 25+ year old rigging for one season without an issue but i did replace it because of the age and one of the bridle wires was starting to fray.
I also know from my engineering background that not all stainless is made equally well and there is a reason it is called stain-less not stain-proof. It will still corrode somewhat over time in a salt environment. The PVC coating probably provides some extra protection unles it is pierced/scraped but there is no way to tell unless you strip it.
Anyway the bottom line is that if you wash you connections with fresh water and change out the rigging on a regular schedule (5-7 years) the coated line is not going to cause you any more grief than uncoated. There is a reason that most boats come stock with it.
If you do a lot of salt water sailing in high like many of the people here do, you are probably better off with uncoated. The reason being that you are going to wear out your rigging much faster than average and being able to inspect the wires is much more important.
Regards,
Dave
--
Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 12:13 AM
Just out of curiosity (and I am deeply saddened by your tragedy) would the mast base and step still be servicable? : ) -
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 03:34 PM
Robluns, was this to me? If so send me a msg...cause I stripped the boat of all good parts and they need a good home!
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 03:42 PM
Culley when you bringing that 6.0 out to Surfside 10 Mile spot? I have many questions for you about my 5.5sl the 6.0's little sister.
Floyd
AKA FA1321
edited by: fa1321, Jul 28, 2010 - 02:59 PM -
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 04:25 PM
[quote=fa1321]Culley when you bringing that 6.0 out to Surfside 10 Mile spot? I have many questions for you about my 5.5sl the 6.0's little sister.
Dude, you caught me slackin'! Ugh, unfortunately my weekends are getting booked at a rapid pace right now. You ever sail during the week? I have one Sunday left in August (the 22nd). You up to a Sunday sail? -
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 04:26 PM
Sent you a PM!
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 04:34 PM
[quote=turtlecat] I will be at Point West in Galveston from Monday thru Friday next week if you want to sail its on the Galveston side of San Luis pass. I have sailed on Sundays and we also have a guy Bob that likes to sail at 10 mile on Sundays and Frank is the Mayor of 10 Mile he is always down there all weekend. I may shoot you a message on Facebook tonight with some questions about the 5.5sl
edited by: fa1321, Jul 28, 2010 - 03:36 PM -
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 04:40 PM
Ill be in Salt Lake all next week. But I just saw that I have that weekend free (7 & 8th)...unbelievable! Ill be watching the FB page to see what gets cooked up! -
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Posted: Jul 28, 2010 - 05:08 PM
Hey SteveOn,
I know your on Canyon(or Hill Country)but if you ever have a weekend where you want to hit some salt water, these guys are a great bunch!
Surfside sailing has a thing on Facebook...I had the link, but Floyd aka fa1321 (above) has the scoop!
edited by: turtlecat, Jul 28, 2010 - 04:17 PM -
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Posted: Jul 29, 2010 - 12:35 AM
I'd love to make it down to the beach. Where exactly is Surfside? We normally make it down to Port A every couple of months, but I haven't taken my cat out in salt yet. After all the repainting/new tramp and rigging she should be sea worthy. The crazy weather pattern has stalled my plans. Hopefully will have the chance to start the revamp during the week of 9-13 Aug.
Steve -
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Posted: Jul 29, 2010 - 12:47 AM
Here is the 10 mile spot its beach access 6
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=10202+Bluewater+Hwy,+Freeport,+Brazoria,+Texas+77541&sll=29.22889,-95.398407&sspn=0.577645,1.229095&ie=UTF8&cd=1&geocode=FeczuwEd-_hT-g&split=0&hq=&hnear=10202+Bluewater+Hwy,+Freeport,+Brazoria,+Texas+77541&t=h&z=16 -
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Posted: Jul 30, 2010 - 10:10 PM
Looks like a great spot to sail. Once I have a free weekend I'll drop you guys a line to see when everyone is headed out there!
Thanks,
Steve -
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Posted: Aug 01, 2010 - 12:07 PM
Its a good spot because its not crowded, you have condos for a nice landmark for miles out at sea and the group of people who show up almost every weekend. If you bring the family down there are not much close such as restrooms, food & shade but you can just unhook your trailer and let them drive up the road a few miles. If you want to make a weekend out of it the condos are closed still but should be open soon you can keep tabs on them here
http://peregrineresort.net/public/home.php
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