Having sailed the 5.2 for over a year, now, I am getting a better feel for cats vs. monohulls. I feel pretty good about my upwind techniques and am getting better every outing with quick, efficient, tacks, and almost never get stuck in irons anymore. Downwind, though, I can use some pointers. Having never used a traveler until this boat, I have learned how to use it to de-power the main when beating in high winds, something I used to take care of by reefing my main on my old hunter. But, for the most part, I don't even think of the traveler when beating.
When on broad reaches, I am not sure what I should be doing with the traveler. I have noted that by easing the traveler out, I don't have to sheet the main out as much, which keeps the boom more stable, and makes my crew, if on the leeward hull, happier with fewer bumps and bruises. What is the traveler/mainsheet relationship in downwind sailing? Also, should I be able to read the telltales, even when going downwind? This seems to be a challenge and I am never sure if I am getting all the speed I can. I have a personal rule that if the main is touching the spreaders, (I have the older, straight spreaders), then I'm sheeted out too far, must sheet in some and not point as low. Any tips for a relative noob?
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Eric C
Force 5 project boat
Unnamed
Previous boat
1980 Nacra 5.2
"Double Vision"
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Downwind in Nacra 5.2
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Posted: Apr 09, 2012 - 02:10 PM
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Posted: Apr 09, 2012 - 02:48 PM
As I fall off .... I to travel out.. further I fall off.. the more l travel out.. till i am dead down wind (or close) and all the way to the beam bolts (actually i have knots in my traveler line that prevent me from slamming into the bolts).
I try to keep my sails off my side-stay's when i can, and even tie up my trap lines to avoid contact.. but its gonna touch at times.
yes your tell tails should still work exactly as they do upwind.. but much trickier to get them to play nice. -
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Posted: Apr 09, 2012 - 06:41 PM
Going downwind is always going to be relatively slow compared to the spin boats. You should try and keep yourself away from straight downwind. Travel out at least half way and play the traveller and main sheet to try and get the tell tails in to play nice. Try to keep some tension on the main sheet if you loosen it completely off you are going to lose power.
You can also move your weight closer to the middle, but be careful!! I was doing that last year and went very deep, the wind switched and the boom cranked me right off the book. I was seeing stars for days.
D.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Apr 09, 2012 - 08:08 PM
You're likely trying to go too far down. Ride the puffs down, but the rest of the time you're on a broad reach if speed is your goal.
I can't maintain speed with the traveler past the inside of the leeward hull. ymmv
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Rob
OKC
Pile of Nacra parts..
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Posted: Apr 09, 2012 - 09:59 PM
Don't know if it is Prindle specific or not but I can get a lot of weather helm if I travel out too much going downwind. If I bring it in some it eases up a lot.
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Dustin Finlinson • Magna, UT
Member: Utah Sailing Association
1982 Prindle 18
1986 Hobie 17
1982 Prindle 16
1980 Prindle 16(mostly)
1976 Prindle 16(mostly)
Check out "Prindle Sailors" on Facebook.
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Posted: Apr 10, 2012 - 05:15 AM
Tacking downwind as was taught to me
Set the main traveler just past the hiking straps, jib traveler all the way out.
Set the mainsheet and jib sheet approx 2 feet between the blocks for a ballpark setting
Head up until the relative wind is at right angles to the centerline of the boat
Trim the main, holding this relative wind angle till the leeward reaching telltale has just reversed
Trim the jib in until the top leeward telltale has almost gone
Result will be good deal of twist in both sails for max power
Head up a little for power the bleed it off to leeward easing the sheets a few inches
REMEMBER GYBE ON THE LIFTS, DIVE TO LEEWARD ON THE HEADERS !!!!!! -
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Posted: Apr 10, 2012 - 11:38 AM
hyperope,
Hullflyer has been taught well.
Don't know what kind of cat he is sailing, so the
can vary a lot from boat to boat, but he gives sound advice.
Catamarans differ greatly from monohulls downwind. Most monos sail fastest close to dead downwind, which would be almost the speed of the wind.
Cats can sail much faster than the wind on a broad reach, because the sail shape is actually pulling the boat through the wind, not just getting pushed from behind. (The fact that cats are so light and carry so much sail allows this.) Gybing downwind gives the greatest overall speed, but the more you point towards straight downwind instead of staying on a broad reach, the slower you will go. Hence this comment: It may not feel slower at the time, but the other guys will leave you in the dust (foam).
His final comment bears repeating: If you are dowwind and get a big puff, do not steer up like you would going upwind. You will turn your side to the power of the wind and it will blow you over much faster than you could ever get to safe head-to-wind. This is counter intuitive at first, and you must practice moving your weight aft fast as you turn down on the puff. If your crew is on trap, make them run aft. As your boatspeed stabilizes, head up again so the apparent wind (on your forestay or shroud wind indicators) moves back to 90 degrees.
Sheet In! (but not in the puffs!)
Bob
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Sheet In!
Bob
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Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 08:56 AM
From my understanding, I always want to keep the apparent wind at 90 degrees on downwind- you are right- a bit counter-intuitive to an old monohuller. What is good to use on shrouds for wind indicator? I don't have a vane, only telltales on the sail.
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Eric C
Force 5 project boat
Unnamed
Previous boat
1980 Nacra 5.2
"Double Vision"
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 10:41 AM
Audion cassette tape in light conditions, VHS tape in heavy conditions. Both are unaffected by water (unlike most string or yarn). The VHS tape is less twitchy in heavy weather conditions. -
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 12:22 PM
Word.
Put them at eye level on the shrouds. My eyes prefer the VHS.
You should consider using a forestay vane. They are easy to see and they keep you looking forward, where the things you crash into come from. Not that I, well, yes I have. Multiple times.
You know those square white paper thingies you throw into the dryer with your clothes? Cut a few into forths and put them in a baggie in your cat box. As you raise the sail, wipe the telltales with a piece of the fabric softener sheet and they will not stick to the sail or window as much, especially in light to medium air.
Going sailing Saturday!
Sheet In!
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Sheet In!
Bob
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Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 12:26 PM
Maybe I'm showing my age here but whats VHS tape?....J/K seriously tho good use of old technology.
Guess I'll have to give dear old dad a call later and find an old tape
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Bob Miller
1983 P16 Sail # 7312
"Miller Time" A work in progress; out of the water for 16 years
Barnegat Bay NJ
Beach Cat Lesson #1 - A free cat isn't
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 12:36 PM
You made me laugh out loud.
I have an old copy of Fast Times at Ridgemont High that I can send you a few yards of...
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Sheet In!
Bob
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Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 12:40 PM
VHS can be had at ANY yard sale for $0.25 each -
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 12:41 PM
Think I have a couple of old Journey and Boston cassettes I never threw out as I knew I would need them one day. Also since my kids are not little anymore, I guess I have plenty of Elmo VHS to use. Thanks for the tip.
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Eric C
Force 5 project boat
Unnamed
Previous boat
1980 Nacra 5.2
"Double Vision"
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 01:29 PM
at first i thought you were gonnna recommend using them on your side stays and wind indicators... lol
tape either tears off or fades away.. instead of tape .... i use tel-tale ribbon
i find tales on my bridal wires (or spin pole bridals) the least influenced by windage and show me the truest wind
Edited by MN3 on Apr 11, 2012 - 01:31 PM. -
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 03:45 PM
I use cassette tape on the shrouds & a Davis wind indicator on the bridal. Cassette is great for light winds, it will stream in 1-2kt. If I want a heavier tape, find an old 8 Track, that product is heavier than cassette, but lighter than VHS. If you really wan to go retro, find a Beta!
I found the tape tended to slide around on th eshrouds, & if you tie it tight, you end up breaking it. I cut a 1cm (1/2") piece from a shoud cover, you know, those white pieces of split tubing, about 4' long that you snap over the shrouds. With the split it will snap right onto the shroud line, just snap it on top of the bit of tape. It will hold it securely, & you can replace the tape in .8 seconds. I leave a couple of bits snapped onto each shroud in case I lose one.
Edited by Edchris177 on Apr 11, 2012 - 03:49 PM.
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 03:48 PM
Ha HA, I thought that was joke at first read.
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Posted: Apr 11, 2012 - 09:00 PM
I've used Davis Instruments Wind-Tels before. Not as cheep as cassette tape, but I loved them. I sold them with the boat I used them on, now I have a Black Max on my spinnaker pole. The Black Max isn't that useful when I'm dead downwind because the spinnaker pole shadows it, but I'm rarely dead downwind.
Wind-Tels (http://www.boatfix.com/shop5/store/viewItem.asp?idProduct=22155)
Black Max (http://www.boatfix.com/shop5/store/viewItem.asp?idProduct=22158)
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Daniel T.
Taipan F16 - USA 213
Clearwater, FL
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