I have sailed dinghies before but am new to cats.
1. In fair weather, what kind & size cat do you need to sail off shore - like from Long Beach to Catalina Island or from Oxnard to the Channel Islands?
2. Also in fair weather, can you sail a cat without getting wet - assuming that you depart from a dock rather than the beach? You can stay dry if you want in dinghies as small as 14' - 16'.
3. In heavier winds, can you reef the main sail on a cat, or sail satisfactorily without the jib?
I have a lot to learn!
New guy with 3 questions
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- Rank: Lubber
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 11:34 AM
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 12:25 PM
most beach cats you get wet nomatter were you depart, i dont know about sailing with out a jib, i have never done it but some boats have the reefing points some dont. for example old hobie 16 have them the new ones dont. -
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 12:37 PM
I can't answer #1. I don't know what the waters are like around Catalina Island. But I sail my 18' (closer to 19') offshore all the time.
#2 depends on the cat. Our Prindle was a soggyboat. We always got wet. I've been told the Prindles were considered "dry" when compared to other boats, though, so maybe we just had a penchant for nailing oncoming waves. My current boat, an old P-Cat, is actually quite dry. Unless we do a MOB drill, people tend to stay pretty dry.
#3 also depends on the cat. On a boomless rig, the answer is no. With a boom there's the possibility. Look at the sail and see if it has reef points. Our Prindle had reef points, as does our P-Cat. But I've seen sails that don't.
You can sail without a jib, but it'll change the tuning of your boat pretty significantly. It's also possible to douse the main and sail on jib alone, though I can say with 100% conviction this will severely change the tuning of your boat. It's not the same as it would be on a keelboat running under a storm jib. Your ability to point goes to pot.
The good news is that except for the really heavy, unsafe wind conditions, all of these are things you can play around with on the water relatively safely. Best way to learn.
Tom
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Tom Benedict
Island of Hawaii
P-Cat 18 / Sail# 361 / HA 7633 H / "Smilodon"
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 12:40 PM
From your questions, you should not even consider sailing to Catalina for a couple years. Any small cat can safely sail to Catalina if the skipper has appropiate safety equipment aboard and the cat is in good condition. If getting wet is your concern, forget it! Wet suit or dry suit is mandatory on cats in most conditions--even when it's hot on the beach as a capsize & delayed righting can expose you to hypothermia. Reefing normally should be done before leaving the beach--hard to do when it's blowing 20. If you're not ADDICTED to sailing at 20 plus knots with above sacrifices, stick to a nice dry 5 knotter. Quite frankly water sailing at 20 is boring to me, when I can sail 50-60 on dry land with normal clothes on and less rigging time. Pete -
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 04:42 PM
what he said
cats are like motorbikes
the cool must be paid for
with discomfort and inconvenience
and if you're lucky
that's all -
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Posted: Jul 16, 2012 - 07:11 AM
18-20 w/LOTS of emergancy gear
beachcats don't do well moored (for more than a few days) and don't typically utilze docks. Some boats with lots of freeboard can stay completely dry in light air
yes. Few (if any) cats come with reefing these days, but you can customize a cat to do it... required a fair amount extra parts and is not really practical
Yes you can sail without a jib in heavy air.. just takes practice. you can even sail with out a main (JIB only) if needed -
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Posted: Jul 16, 2012 - 11:36 AM
There are a lot of stories (blogs and stories published online) about some people I would practically consider experts due to their years of experience and great lengths of safety precautions, and they write about their sailing trips to the islands. Once they get to them they have to beach the cat and if you've been to the channel islands then you know it's usually steep and rocky.
This person may be on this site:
http://www.everytrail.com/view_trip.php?trip_id=7930
But just google search it and you'll find a dozen articles, some pretty horrific stories about cross bars breaking and rudders breakings and shrouds snapping and running over submerged objects and anything else imaginable going wrong - But also very rewarding to get parts of the island to yourself and skip along to empty beaches and camp out, and do it all with just your catamaran.
1. a very well equipped 18'-20' cat, to sail fast enough and have enough space for gear and at least two people. And southern california sailors all know well that fair weather turns in a second to blanketed fog or worse out in the channel. Currents are an important factor. The last thing I would want is little wind, thick fog, strong currents, and to be in the middle of a shipping lane. Just a bobbing target.
2. These boats are wet even in the best weather on the ocean. due to even small chop and especially anything of sizeable swell, the waves wash up from under the trampoline and splash everything on board. At good speed you'll get water shot at you from the bows slicing through waves. I almost always wear a wetsuit, surf boots, and gloves when I'm on the ocean. And that's only because I'm making due with my surf stuff. I bet true sailors go with full on dry suits like Pbegle mentions.
3. The guys are right about the sails/reefing above. With that size boat and making beach landings in and out of coves I would suggest a roller furling jib, main with reef points, and a small motor.
Like you, I have been interested in sailing to the islands, too, as I've been there before on 50-60ft powerboats, and it you see larger sailboats do it everyday. I've even thought "What the hell, what's the worst that could happen?" but the fact is, a lot can happen.
I think that you should absolutely get into a cat, and as you work your way into being comfortable in all kinds of situations with the boat, then try to sail from harbor to harbor along the CA coast. Like Marina Del Rey to Redondo and back... on a cat with good weather takes only a hour there and an hour back. Long beach to Newport or Dana Point seems like it would be a great ride too, and you can run along shore where there's always people and soft sandy beaches.
There's a few groups of guys who make the trip out of Oxnard or Long beach or San Diego to the islands, maybe they can chime in here too.
Glad to hear you're moving from monohulls to cats and best of luck
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Redondo Beach, CA
'80 Prindle 16.
(Got it for free!)
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