The 5.7 is undergoing a major refurbishment after the skeg hulls wore through the bottom last year. So far, I have fully re-glassed the bottoms with Kevlar and West Systems epoxy, and the fairing is underway. Also fully cleaned up the gel coat with oxalic acid, and am doing gel coat repairs where it is crazed or cracked. All the decals are stripped and the hull is sanded.
Gel coat is still pretty good on most of the boat except where repairs along the keel line have been made, a hole repair on the left hull and some minor burn-throughs where sanding out the crazing took out the thickness. I'm trying to decide on using gel coat or paint to finish. Gel coat is far more durable and is more difficult. I would esitmate needing at least 3-gallons to cover to .2 mills over both hulls. In reality, I would shoot the upper surfaces thinner. This is followed by sanding, finer sanding, compounding and buffing. Paint would be faster and cheaper and not as durable.
I would really like to hear stories from any owners that have done this in the past, recommendations, and things to watch out for. Thanks,
Tom
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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NACRA 5.7 refurb: Gel Coat or Paint?
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Posted: Jun 14, 2016 - 11:38 PM
I'm refurbing my 5.2 as well and long ago passed up on using gel coat as the finish. I like the options that come with good paint in terms of color. I think even a one part polyurethane is better in term of UV resistance, certainly easier to do. This time around I am going with an epoxy primer followed by a two part polyurethane. These kinds of finishes are much harder, have better UV resistance and are easy to repair. While I have the capability to spray a finish, the Interlux Perfection can be rolled and tipped very successfully so I'm planning to use it and will document the results. These are not inexpensive finishes, between the epoxy primer and the Perfection product I have invested a few hundred dollars so far.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jun 15, 2016 - 08:49 AM
I've sprayed 3 boats with 2 part polyurethanes, 2 of them were DuPont imron. They turned out great and the one is still have stills looks nice a couple years out. i sprayed a coat of clear over one of them and it really made it shine.
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Mac
Midlands South Carolina
AHPC Viper USA 366
A Cat USA 366
Super Cat 17
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Posted: Jun 15, 2016 - 09:10 AM
I have a mystere 6.0 that was painted w imron
looks great every 9 months I put on a coat of nufinish -
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Posted: Jun 16, 2016 - 02:32 PM
This is great input. I was looking at using a gray surface primer over the repaired areas to improve adhesion, and then was looking at a mix of white gel coat and Duratec white gloss for the finishing, with the final coat shot with a wax/styrene surfacing agent. After that, lots and lots of sanding and buffing. The biggest drawback is the need to buy a specialty gun with 2.5mm tip, and of course all the pots of catalyzed gel coat with cleaning between each mix.
Sounds like 2-part paint is the consensus.
Who did you source materials through for this? Can you specify what primer and 2-part poly you used? Any details in terms of expected coverage and application equipment would be greatly appreciated.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jun 16, 2016 - 03:19 PM
I am using AwlGrip's 545 primer system and it was sourced from Fisheries Supply, but there are lots of sources for this stuff. There are also several other epoxy primers that could be used on fiberglass. I'm using the 545 because it also works well with the wash coat I am spraying on all of the aluminum parts. The final two part poly will be Interlux Perfection. My motivation for using the Perfection product was that my brother the high end boat builder swears you can get great results from the roll and tip method of application for Perfection. Since that fits with most guys abilities I thought I would show the method and the results. If this goes badly I am going to have words with my little brother.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jun 16, 2016 - 03:34 PM
Thanks for getting back. I will look into the AwlGrip 545. I was aware of Perfection, and it's pretty expensive stuff from Jamestown, although coverage seems to be good. Are you estimating 3-4 quarts (2-3 coats)?
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jun 16, 2016 - 10:13 PM
I have ordered 1/2 gallon and wouldn't be surprised if I need more than that. What I understand is that the coats are very thin and that 3 coats is the minimum (if nothing goes wrong). I'm staying with a dark blue hull color and the 545 I'm using is grey. I am not thinking about the expense on this project, just getting it done. So if it needs more then more it will get it. This boat deserves a little bit of luxury after 40 years of abuse.
Originally I was going to go with an automotive two part poly until my genius brother swore this was the way to go. Stay tuned....
This could be a double post again, got another error message on upload.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jun 16, 2016 - 10:42 PM
I have a feeling you're looking at 3-quarts. I found Perfection at $59.97/qt at Discount Marine. If going this route, I'm inclined to use Interlux Primekote as the under coat at under $100 per gallon, then finish with Perfection. I have decent pneumatic spray skills with lacquers and 2-part enamel automotive finishes, and need to look into doing this as a spray vs roll and tip. Your information has been a big help, and I think I'm over going with gel coat.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jun 16, 2016 - 10:54 PM
Not so fast. Paint is the way to go if re-doing an entire hull, but that wasn't the plan if I read correctly. If doing touch up work or a bottom job that you want to blend into the original area, sprayed gelcoat color matched by a local pro is IMO the way to go. Mixing gelcoat and paint on the same hull is a recipe for problems down the road. -
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Posted: Jun 17, 2016 - 11:00 AM
It's possible the upper hull could be buffed back, but this 1984 boat is getting pretty thin on gel coat in many spots, and the crazed cracks have been sanded almost to the substrate in several areas. The entire keel needs a full finish. The plan was to restore the entire hull with gel coat or paint. Here are some pictures of the project showing the extent of the repairs.
I think I'll get great looking results on this old boat using good 2-part paint. At this point it looks like roll and tip is safer considering the paints contain diisocyanurates
Edited by tominpa on Jun 17, 2016 - 12:03 PM.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jun 18, 2016 - 11:01 PM
Made all my paint purchases yesterday. It ain't cheap. I was going to ask Jamestown for a price match to DiscountMarineSupplies, but just placed the order. The difference was over $100.
Qty Item Price Total
3 SKU: INT YHS248KITQ
Interlux Perfection 2 Part Polyurethane Kit
858.98 176.94
1 SKU: INT 404/14Q Interlux Epoxy Primekote 89.07 89.07
1 SKU: INT 333PInterlux Thinner, Solvent & Cleaners 13.56 13.56
4 SKU: Corona Slicker Solvent Resistant Foam Rollers Corona Slicker Solvent Resistant Foam Rollers 2.29 9.16
Balance 288.73
Shipping 0.00
Tax 17.32
Total 306.05
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jun 22, 2016 - 12:24 AM
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3XwvsorsYw]
Here is some good and relevant info on this topic of paint vs. gelcoat from Boatworks Today.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jun 23, 2016 - 11:11 PM
Good video, and it seems I made the right decision. I completed the fairing work, and washed down the dust on the hulls and floor. I have just a couple minor areas to go over, and I can start the final coating.
Meanwhile, I have a motorcycle trip this weekend. I'm riding 750 miles from Pittsburgh to Cullman AL tomorrow morning to get started. Wish me luck.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jun 24, 2016 - 08:42 AM
good luck -
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Posted: Jun 24, 2016 - 03:13 PM
Yea have fun. I'm still waiting for the rest of my 545 primer to show up. I have the mast and beams coated with the wash ready for primer and one hull is fair and ready for primer. Then there is a whole other hull that has to be sanded down, checked for cracking, faired and then primed. My project is going to go on and on for a while yet.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jun 28, 2016 - 02:21 PM
First post. Taking delivery of my new (to me) 5.7 in a few weeks. I have never owned a cat before so will be spending some time getting a feel for the boat but assuming all goes well, I expect to be doing this over the winter.
Take lots of pictures and keep us updated!
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Devonshire, Bermuda
NACRA 5.7
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Posted: Jul 07, 2016 - 07:58 PM
After a mis-queue in ordering solvent reducer, I finally have everything ready to go (accidentally ordered the 333 brushing reducer for Brightside, instead of 2333 for Perfection). The hulls are suspended from the garage ceiling, masked and washed. I am waiting on some lower humidity as this week has been hot with humidity over 60%. Also have family visiting which has kept me busy. I should be able to start primer tomorrow. I'll take some pictures.
The hulls look "worked". There are lots of patches of fairing compound where past damage has been repaired, and even the cracks around the bridle wires have been chipped out and resurfaced. Lots of crazing lines have been sanded and faired. Even so, the decals protected the gel coat from erosion over the years, and I should be able to see where to reinstall striping. You just don't know how worn a hull is until you start to renew it. I'll keep the forum posted on progress, and over the next 2-weeks we should see completion and a launch.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 01:26 AM
[http://www.eyeinhand.com/2011/06/27/painting-rolling-and-tipping/]
This guy was working with the Brightside product but has lots of good info on this process. There is also a video of him doing the work.
I'm trying to think through this hull positioning thing relative to wet edges etc. I suspect there is no right answer, but I'm thinking to start upside down working on sawhorses. That lets me get both sides and the bottom and the hulls will be very stationary. Then go to a hanging position for the deck. I'm certain that when you start a new area (like the deck in my case) you are going to want a hardened paint surface and then lightly sand into that with 320 or 400 and then roll and tip into the newly sanded area. it is hard to imagine being able to do this all from just one position getting the entire hull. I think the wet edge issue is important to manage.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 11:17 PM
Primer is a good lesson in learning to apply this stuff. Do not fear the thinner. My first coat started off too thick and was difficult to get even, but not a big deal with a sandable primer. I added some reducer and started getting better results, but still not what I hope for in the final finish coats. Thinned to the point that the paint tipped well, it does not fully cover darker fairing compounds. By the second coat it should look pretty uniform.
Do not get anywhere near this stuff with clothes you remotely care about. No mater how careful you are, you will contact the paint. I was working in an open, well-ventilated garage, and will pick up organic respirator cartridges before the second coat. Pretty intense fumes that smell like isoamyl acetate used for respirator test-fitting.
I found suspending the hulls from the ceiling and starting at the stern, gives me the best chance to keep a wet edge. I coated the transom and top, ten proceeded around the outside. As I reached the bow, I painted the entire bow section ahead of the bridle wire tang, including the top side. then came around the bow, and continued towards the stern on the inside. This maintained a wet-edge on the top and inside-bow section. Try not to over-think this. The original boat was glued together on the stern and under the non-slip top in a pretty crude manner. The final paint job is going to look a lot better than that old seam.
The bottom of the boat is not visible anyway, and compared to the project linked by dmgbear55, the catamaran is small. I did both hulls, and used 1.5 quarts of primer with 10-12% reducer to cover everything, including the rudders. I was hoping to get coverage of both hulls with 1-quart, but this was in-line with my original esitmates for the 5.7 at 200 feet per coat. So my 3-quarts of final should give me the 2-coats I need, and I will get 2-coats of primer with enough left over to triple coat the bottom of the hulls and rudders. I am also coating the topside access ports since they tend to yellow in the sun.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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