Okay so I removed the rudders from my "new to me" H16 and one cotter pin broke off inside the hole in the hinge pin and I cannot seem to get it out. I have tried a small punch and even broke a drill bit trying g to drill it out. Anyone have any suggestions or should I keep trying to push it out with the punch or drill it? My thinking is that I would use rings, for securing the hinge pins, instead of the cotter pins so that I could easily remove the rudders when traveling. Thanks for any suggestions.
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Cotter Pins and Rudder Hinge Pin, H16
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 08:18 PM
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 10:25 PM
Should be able to get the pin in a vice and gently tap or drill the cotter pin out. If they are nylon they may deform from too much pounding. It's a nice cheap replacement part to have on hand, I like stainless ones. I wouldn't worry about taking rudders off for transport, not really many benefits and adds to setup time. -
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 10:26 PM
Get a new pin? They're like $10, why kill yourself on this.
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Edited by Dogboy on Jul 08, 2016 - 10:28 PM. -
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 10:34 PM
Thanks, and these are aluminum pins. I was thinking about changing them to stainless. Dogboy, where do you find pins for 10 bucks? The ones I have seen are sold in pairs, I think I saw the stainless ones on ebay for something like 25 bucks with shipping.
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 10:47 PM
You could just drill another hole in the pin. I bought a length of stainless from the metal yard for something like 30 bucks. It's enough for 4-5 pairs of rudder pins and they are indestructible unlike the aluminum ones. -
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Posted: Jul 08, 2016 - 10:59 PM
Yes I was thinking about just drilling the cotter pin out with a slightly larger drill bit. Hey tamumpower1, looking at your avatar, it seems we have the same style of sail, the color panels are flipped though, neat.
Edited by martyr on Jul 08, 2016 - 11:23 PM.
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Posted: Jul 09, 2016 - 12:01 AM
Yea both my boats have the same style sail but my yellow hull 18 has the same sail as yours where the stripe is flipped.
The yellow boat is a 85 and the white one a 86. Since your boat is an 84 I guess that was just an update they made for a different year.
Edited by tamumpower1 on Jul 09, 2016 - 01:12 AM. -
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Posted: Jul 09, 2016 - 07:36 AM
You can order a 2 foot length of 316 SS rod, 3/8" diameter from McMaster Carr for $9. Enough for at least 2 pins. Cut it to length and drill your holes. It will never bend, break, or corrode. Just make sure it isn't in direct contact with the rudder casting (use bushings) or it will seize in the casting.
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Posted: Jul 09, 2016 - 08:09 PM
Hey thanks. Yeah, I tried drilling that little booger out of the hole again today with no luck. I think I will just replace the aluminum pins with stainless after all. Thanks again!!!
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Posted: Jul 09, 2016 - 11:22 PM
You can get 3/8" aluminum rod at Home Depot then cut and drill your own. Very quick and easy with a vise, hack saw and hand drill.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-3-8-in-x-48-in-Aluminum-Round-Rod-800367/204604768
Don't forget to pick up new cotter pins as well.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/The-Hillman-Group-3-32-in-x-3-4-in-Stainless-Steel-Cotter-Pin-35-Pack-43693/204786168
Note that the aluminum pins are more forgiving than SS pins in a crash and act sacrificially. Further, being softer than the SS gudgeons, the gudgeons will wear slower as well as your rudder castings.
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Hobie 16 (3 formerly)
MacGregor 25 (formerly)
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High Point, NC
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Posted: Jul 10, 2016 - 07:04 AM
Thank you all for your help. Very useful information on here. Thanks so much, now, gotta get those rudders back on the boat and go sailing, if only the weather would agree. I've been off all week and it has rained nearly every day. Ready to get this boat in the water!
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Posted: Jul 10, 2016 - 09:43 AM
I would definitely not recommend using aluminum rod from Home Depot. It is most likely cheap, architectural grade alloy. I personally don't recommend using anything other than stainless steel for rudder pins (except maybe if you're surf sailing, end even then it's a big maybe). Sailing the boat with a broken rudder pin is no easy task. Anyway, if you plan to use aluminum, I would use either 6061-T6 or 7075-T7351 alloy pins as they will be much stronger than what you get from Home depot.
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Posted: Jul 10, 2016 - 10:39 AM
I have used hardware store aluminum rods on my catamarans since first replacing the plastic ones on my Hobie 14 back in 1970. "Hey Mon, no problems. Like too much brains used for such simple problems." -
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Posted: Jul 10, 2016 - 10:38 PM
My experience as well.
BTW martyr sorry to hear about the closing of the War Eagle Supper Club in 2015. It was on my short list of coolest places of all time.
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Hobie 16 (3 formerly)
MacGregor 25 (formerly)
Chrysler Dagger 14 (formerly)
NACRA 5.0 (currently)
High Point, NC
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Posted: Jul 10, 2016 - 10:48 PM
Yes that is sad that it closed. It was definitely a local landmark.
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Posted: Jul 10, 2016 - 11:01 PM
Good news!!! I thank you all for the tips, advice, and direction with this project. I was able to punch the little broken cotter pin out of the hinge pin after I soaked it in some PB Blaster, it popped right out. I just got this boat exactly one week ago and I am still going through a box that has all the traps, harnesses, and manuals and other goodies. There is a zippered bag thing that has extra parts in it and I have found that it is the bag that is sold through Murray's, in fact, the bag has Murray's on it, anyway, it sells for 90 bucks and includes lots of little extra stuff, including cotter pins and, you guessed it, hinge pins!!! The previous owner was very meticulous with this boat and it really shows with all the extra stuff this thing has. Very fortunate to have found this forum as well, thank you for all the help and support. I am going to post another question separate from this topic, maybe y'all can help with that one.
Thanks again
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Marty
1984 Hobie 16 Redline Yellow Nationals, "Yellow Fever"
Opelika, Al / Lake Martin
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Posted: Jul 11, 2016 - 10:39 AM
This depends on the amount of travel and "bounce"
short trips to the beach are no big deal
long trips or on bouncy roads are a different creature.
vibrations and especially hard bouncing will put some wear and stress on your attachment points.
I personally take my rudders off every time I go to the beach or come home.
my rudders are new, expensive and none of the pivot points are wormed out from wear.. I plan to keep them this way. My pin is bent on the top (no cotter pin nor ring ding needed) and only has 1 ring-ding needed to put on/take off. so easy a caveman can do it.
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Posted: Jul 11, 2016 - 01:32 PM
Perhaps, but I'd rather use some brains and take the time to think about what the correct material is to use for the application rather than having to think about how to get my boat back to shore after busting a rudder pin or how to come up with the hundreds of bucks needed to replace a rudder system because I cheeped out and used a piece of junk rod from Home Depot for my rudder pin.
I know too many people who have broken rudder pins and struggled to get back home- none of them were using stainless.
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Posted: Jul 11, 2016 - 03:20 PM
I would be careful where I got my parts from
Home Depot and other box stores carry the cheapest, Chinese made products available
Modern "crap" metal is all over the place - china is the main source
these metals will rust, seize and fail much faster than higher quality stuff
http://www.practicalmachi…aluminum-sources-301732/ -
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Posted: Jul 11, 2016 - 07:09 PM
x2, though I've been using hairpin cotter pins on the bottom, but maybe I should switch to ringdings. Small inland lake sailing though.
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Matt Miller in Colorado
'82 H14 Turbo #38674 Red/Gold
'85 H18 #13222 Nationals White (Prism)
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