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Boat ramp launching

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MN3

Rank: Master Chief

Registered: Jun 20, 2006

Last visit: May 22, 2024

Posts: 7089
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 03:51 PM

Quote"I have fantasized about an electric winch pulling up the cat by the front crossbeam, and using it to help . me raise and lower the mast."

We have an "older" guy on our beach that uses a winch/remote on his (gcat) mast for both stepping and unstepping - seems to work well for him

I had a dream... using a winch to help pull my cat/trailer into my backyard so i didn't have to wrestle my 500lb cat and 800lb trailer into my back yard (solo) every week ...

i purchased a harbor freight atv winch and built an anchor/platform for it

set it up and hit the remote .... all was great for about 20 seconds and then it stopped - wouldn't start again
so i re-read the owner manual ... and called up a friend about duty cycles. ends up this HF turd would go about 20 seconds in the fl heat and then take a 15 min break

i would advise anyone who wants a winch for this to do a lot of homework on the duty cycle of the winch

on a totally unrelated note: i have a hardly used HF winch for sale :)
mattson

Rank: Online Pioneer

Registered: Apr 23, 2002

Last visit: Feb 18, 2022

Posts: 211
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 03:55 PM

Launching and landing from a ramp can be tricky, particularly when the wind blows perpendicular to the docks, as it usually does in Ventura. I was so familiar with my old Hobie 18, that I would land at the end of the dock. the big BIG risk here is that if the bow clocks around to the windward side of the dock, you are totally screwed, with the boat on a beam reach down the dock with no way to stop it. I only had one time where that situation started to develop so I just pushed off the dock and tried again. You really have to be aware of this developing and abort right away.

Below is a video of one of my landings at the end of a dock, which starts at the 3:30 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OciFVggYvB4

Or watch the whole think if you'd like to see my annotated screw ups with the down haul line and tiller stick.

I think I pulled this method off once with the Prindle 19 in light air. You really have to know the boat behavior to pull this off and I am just not there yet with the Prindle. So the other method is the raise the boards and starboard rudder in advance, then come in on a beach reach between the ramps (scaring the crap out of any bystanders on the ramp), then rounding up at the last second, jumping off on the ramp side, getting control of the bow, and walking it to the dock. This is not all that easy either.

--
Bill Mattson
Prindle 19 "Gelli Bean"
Prindle 19 "Cat's Pajamas"
Nacra 5.2 (Will sail her a bit and let her name herself)
--
MN3

Rank: Master Chief

Registered: Jun 20, 2006

Last visit: May 22, 2024

Posts: 7089
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 04:24 PM

mattsonLaunching and landing from a ramp can be tricky, particularly when the wind blows perpendicular to the docks, as it usually does in Ventura. I was so familiar with my old Hobie 18, that I would land at the end of the dock. the big BIG risk here is that if the bow clocks around to the windward side of the dock, you are totally screwed, with the boat on a beam reach down the dock with no way to stop it. I only had one time where that situation started to develop so I just pushed off the dock and tried again. You really have to be aware of this developing and abort right away.

Below is a video of one of my landings at the end of a dock, which starts at the 3:30 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OciFVggYvB4

Or watch the whole think if you'd like to see my annotated screw ups with the down haul line and tiller stick.

I think I pulled this method off once with the Prindle 19 in light air. You really have to know the boat behavior to pull this off and I am just not there yet with the Prindle. So the other method is the raise the boards and starboard rudder in advance, then come in on a beach reach between the ramps (scaring the crap out of any bystanders on the ramp), then rounding up at the last second, jumping off on the ramp side, getting control of the bow, and walking it to the dock. This is not all that easy either.

WOW !
nohuhu

Rank: Mate

Registered: Sep 16, 2016

Last visit: Sep 10, 2021

Posts: 274
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 05:18 PM

Impressive single handed docking w/gybe in big wind! It's a lot to think about solo.

I single-handed yesterday, where our beach launch requires us to go shallow, round up 180º, unlock our floating wheels, load the boat on them and then push it uphill backwards onto the beach. Very manageable in heavy wind w/2 people and a Hobie rudder system, but rudders on older boats like my P18 (and your P19) do not unlock manually. Solo, I need to ground them first. Either that or jump off in just the right depth, kick them up by hand and race to the front before the bows start moving again.

I found that having the Hawaiian righting system with a chicken line running down the side of the hulls makes it much easier to handle the boat as you walk all around it by yourself. It helps me avoid backing the rudders in the sand or having a runaway cat. I think it would help quite a bit when docking, as well.

Sailing in warm water with tide ranges of less than 3 feet helps too.

Bill, your docking technique was pretty, but we'd like to see your video outtakes some day.

--
Prindle 18
96734
--
cholley12

Rank: Mate

Registered: Feb 28, 2018

Last visit: Feb 13, 2023

Posts: 145
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 08:15 PM

I've dock landed a few times with my prindle 19.

The way I usually do it is land into the wind or close to and completely blow the main. I also keep my jib halyard (detached part) tied onto my by bridle lines to use as a bow painter if needed and I'll grab that and hold it tight and back the boat into a cleat. The. Use my righting line as a spring. I also have used my righting line as a spring when landing on more of a reach

--
Captain Chris Holley
Fulshear, TX
'87 Prindle 19 "¡Hijole!"
'74 sunfish "1fish"
--
klozhald

Rank: Chief

Registered: Apr 19, 2011

Last visit: Nov 20, 2024

Posts: 1460
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 08:24 PM

MattsonSo the other method is the raise the boards and starboard rudder in advance, then come in on a beach reach between the ramps (scaring the crap out of any bystanders on the ramp), then rounding up at the last second, jumping off on the ramp side, getting control of the bow, and walking it to the dock. This is not all that easy either.

Bill's elegant dismount at the end of the dock in this video is beyond us mortals, so the rest of us have to make do with the technique he describes above. It all happens so quick, you have to pull up the starboard rudder and centerboard before you gybe, and keep all your lines clear and in-hand during the reach between the docks so you can dump power and cut into the wind simultaneously. Many have mis-timed this and crashed into the dock under power (and under-insured!).

In other news, rumor has it Bobby Martinez once sailed up virtually to the concrete at his crew's insistence because they were being followed by a shark and the crew wanted really shallow water to jump into. Film @ 11.

Edited by klozhald on Apr 08, 2019 - 07:47 PM.

--
Sheet In!
Bob
_/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
--
klozhald

Rank: Chief

Registered: Apr 19, 2011

Last visit: Nov 20, 2024

Posts: 1460
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 08:45 PM

MN3so i re-read the owner manual ... and called up a friend about duty cycles. ends up this HF turd would go about 20 seconds in the fl heat and then take a 15 min break

i would advise anyone who wants a winch for this to do a lot of homework on the duty cycle of the winch

You related this in a post a few years back when I was scouting for a winch and looking at the same HF you used. What I found was that in the less than $100 range all the winches through Amazon and eBay with decent duty cycles pulled at a 1.7 foot-per-minute speed. Really frustrating, but less than if I had not seen your post and bought what I was looking at before.

--
Sheet In!
Bob
_/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
--
nohuhu

Rank: Mate

Registered: Sep 16, 2016

Last visit: Sep 10, 2021

Posts: 274
Posted: Apr 08, 2019 - 09:44 PM

When a trailer and beach wheels are not viable options, a couple 10ft sections of 4” or larger pvc pipe will roll your boat beautifully.

If it was good enuff to build the pyramids,..

--
Prindle 18
96734
--
MN3

Rank: Master Chief

Registered: Jun 20, 2006

Last visit: May 22, 2024

Posts: 7089
Posted: Apr 09, 2019 - 09:42 AM

QuoteYou related this in a post a few years back

I thought the story sounded familiar :)

QuoteWhen a trailer and beach wheels are not viable options, a couple 10ft sections of 4” or larger pvc pipe will roll your boat beautifully.

+1
mattson

Rank: Online Pioneer

Registered: Apr 23, 2002

Last visit: Feb 18, 2022

Posts: 211
Posted: Apr 11, 2019 - 10:21 AM

nohuhuImpressive single handed docking w/gybe in big wind! It's a lot to think about solo.

I single-handed yesterday, where our beach launch requires us to go shallow, round up 180º, unlock our floating wheels, load the boat on them and then push it uphill backwards onto the beach. Very manageable in heavy wind w/2 people and a Hobie rudder system, but rudders on older boats like my P18 (and your P19) do not unlock manually. Solo, I need to ground them first. Either that or jump off in just the right depth, kick them up by hand and race to the front before the bows start moving again.

I found that having the Hawaiian righting system with a chicken line running down the side of the hulls makes it much easier to handle the boat as you walk all around it by yourself. It helps me avoid backing the rudders in the sand or having a runaway cat. I think it would help quite a bit when docking, as well.

Sailing in warm water with tide ranges of less than 3 feet helps too.

Bill, your docking technique was pretty, but we'd like to see your video outtakes some day.

I can see the Hawaiian righting system would be really handy to control a boat solo. Instant handling of the bow and stern.

No outtakes were filmed. I think it is amazing that I stuck the landing with a camera running.

--
Bill Mattson
Prindle 19 "Gelli Bean"
Prindle 19 "Cat's Pajamas"
Nacra 5.2 (Will sail her a bit and let her name herself)
--