I'm looking at what I want to change to my Dart 18 for the next everglades challenge, and one thing that became clear is that the gear strapped to the tramp has got to go in the hulls. If I do that, the deck load won't be so grabby of lines, I'll be able to move my weight to sail the boat more efficiently, and overall weight will be lower.
I've talked to some guys who use long skinny dry bags and feed them through round access hatches. This is probably the simplest and most reliable way. The curve of the deck is more than a round hatch can be screwed to, but I can build up a flat spot to attach the hatch.
Is there a way to build or buy waterproof hatches that would be bigger and easier to load? I picture a laminated plywood hatch cover that matches the curve of the deck, but I fear it will leak a lot.
Plan C might look like this: https://www.westmarine.com/buy/imtra-corporation--rectangular-hatch--17193103?recordNum=12
Access hatches
-
- Rank: Lubber
- Registered: Aug 16, 2018
- Last visit: Jun 29, 2024
- Posts: 25
Posted: Mar 19, 2020 - 09:10 PM
-
- Rank: Master Chief
- Registered: Jun 20, 2006
- Last visit: May 22, 2024
- Posts: 7089
Posted: Mar 20, 2020 - 09:19 AM
Both my Mystere's have square hatches like your "plan C"
I wish neither were there.
my confidence is not supper high they would be water tight in a capsize (the latch wears down over time)
they are not a safe option in an endurance event imho -
- Rank: Lubber
- Registered: Aug 16, 2018
- Last visit: Jun 29, 2024
- Posts: 25
Posted: Mar 20, 2020 - 10:11 AM
Yeah, I suspected as much. Even dry bags are a relative thing in those conditions -
- Rank: Mate
- Registered: Mar 19, 2004
- Last visit: Nov 21, 2024
- Posts: 964
Posted: Mar 20, 2020 - 08:33 PM
With a large rectangular hatch, you would probably have enough room to glass in bulkheads fore & aft to make a water-tight compartment. If the hatch did leak, you would not flood the entire hull.
sm -
- Rank: Master Chief
- Registered: Jun 20, 2006
- Last visit: May 22, 2024
- Posts: 7089
Posted: Mar 20, 2020 - 09:00 PM
not a bad idea
i would want a drain plug somewhere to drain it too
maybe a project for me over the next few weeks -
- Rank: Online Pioneer
- Registered: Apr 23, 2002
- Last visit: Feb 18, 2022
- Posts: 211
Posted: Mar 21, 2020 - 09:57 AM
Not sure what conditions you are up against, but on camping trips to the Channel Islands, we didn't keep much weight in the hulls. The aversion to this was based on the idea that in a capsize situation, the added weight might turtle the boat, and also inhibit righting. And if the boat is upside down, you're not going to be able to get rid of the weight, as the hatches will be submerged.
On the H18, our cargo bags went just behind the mast, with cargo straps leading to a ripcord system under the trampoline where the bags could be released quickly in a capsize, if needed. Also, I had a secondary set of cargo straps rigged at the rear of the trampoline, in case conditions had me wanting to shift the weight back. That would be a pain in the a** on tacks, but on channel crossings we are typically on one tack for 20 miles.
Your mileage may vary. Just some things to consider.
--
Bill Mattson
Prindle 19 "Gelli Bean"
Prindle 19 "Cat's Pajamas"
Nacra 5.2 (Will sail her a bit and let her name herself)
-- -
- Rank: Lubber
- Registered: Aug 16, 2018
- Last visit: Jun 29, 2024
- Posts: 25
Posted: Mar 21, 2020 - 12:22 PM
I had 3 large drybags plus a duffle bag for incidentals on the tramp. Conditions this year were pretty extreme. Even a good quality drybag would leak if it wasn't carefully rolled up tight and my Spot gps tracker didn't have a chance of survival on deck past day 1.
I did have a plan in the back of my mind that I could unclip the bags in event of a capsize and let them float on a tether or use them to help right the boat. I'm not sure how practical that idea would be in the wind/wave conditions I was in. Having the weight in the hulls would be better than on the tramp in terms of turtling. I think the best way to deal with a capsize (besides prevention) is a robust and easily deployable righting pole.
As for weight transfer, the dart has finer hulls than a prindle. My 200 lbs can trim the boat the way I want it. If I have enough power to submarine the bows, I can always reef.
I like the bulkhead idea. It would also help restore structural integrity from the hole. -
- Rank: Chief
- Registered: Apr 19, 2011
- Last visit: Nov 20, 2024
- Posts: 1460
Posted: Mar 23, 2020 - 04:54 PM
So the port in the hull would have to be big enough diagonally to allow you to put a full size one-piece bulkhead inside the hull. It would be difficult to engineer a two piece bulkhead that will withstand the pressures endured. You are only going to be able to glass in it place from one side = weak. Measure twice before you buy or cut. Your hole will be bigger than the port opening, so that may be a help.
(Spurious fact: Manhole covers are round so they can never fall into the hole.)
Edited by klozhald on Mar 23, 2020 - 03:55 PM.
--
Sheet In!
Bob
_/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
-- -
- Rank: Master Chief
- Registered: Jun 20, 2006
- Last visit: May 22, 2024
- Posts: 7089
Posted: Mar 23, 2020 - 05:33 PM
nice! never knew that
we had a local who built a beer cooler into his prindle hull... -
- Rank: Chief
- Registered: Apr 19, 2011
- Last visit: Nov 20, 2024
- Posts: 1460
Posted: Mar 23, 2020 - 06:37 PM
Well, that combines my two favorite pastimes!
--
Sheet In!
Bob
_/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
(Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
Arizona, USA
-- -
- Rank: Lubber
- Registered: Jul 14, 2015
- Last visit: Aug 20, 2024
- Posts: 77
Posted: Mar 23, 2020 - 06:49 PM
The dart catamaran hulls have solid foam that acts as hull stiffening and doesn't allow for much internal storage.
--
Dart 20
-- -
- Rank: Mate
- Registered: Mar 19, 2004
- Last visit: Nov 21, 2024
- Posts: 964
Posted: Mar 23, 2020 - 07:46 PM
Bulkhead could be glassed (at least partially) from both sides by glassing on “tabs” on the backside that are then bonded (epoxied) to the hull. A two-piece bulkhead would also be a potential option, reinforced using stiffening ribs. I would definitely figure out the necessary size/shape using cardboard or similar templates before cutting HD foam. All doable with some thought and patience.
sm -
- Rank: Lubber
- Registered: Aug 16, 2018
- Last visit: Jun 29, 2024
- Posts: 25
Posted: Mar 31, 2020 - 11:15 AM
Probably going to go with a RWO screw in hatch. If I've learned one thing about ocean sailing, it's that simple is better. -
- Rank: Mate
- Registered: Nov 22, 2012
- Last visit: Nov 20, 2024
- Posts: 410
Posted: Apr 08, 2020 - 04:31 PM
I agree with the bulkhead ideas... Even to the point of adding several through out the hulls for safety. Basically, have a few watertight bulkheads incase of a leak, or a collision. I would think of one at the front beam, board trunk, and aft beam. yes, you would need to add inspection ports to access each of the areas. But, you could then install a square hatch mid-ships for storage. For this event, I would look at making the boat wider for stability. My 18-2 is 10' wide and makes a huge difference on stability.
--
Scott
Prindle Fleet 2
TCDYC
Prindle 18-2 Mod "FrankenKitty"
Tornado Classic "Fast Furniture"
Prindle 19 "Mr. Wiggly"
Nacra 5.8 "De ja vu"
Nacra 5.0
Nacra 5.8
Tornadoes (Reg White)
-- -
- Rank: Lubber
- Registered: Aug 16, 2018
- Last visit: Jun 29, 2024
- Posts: 25
Posted: Apr 09, 2020 - 03:39 PM
I like the idea of making it wider. There's a few issues. I'm in Canada, and there aren't as many scrap boats as I see on the market in the states, so it might be difficult to find a mast section to do the job. (not a deal breaker though. I'd need to extend the existing tramp or make a new one. The jib is sheeted off of a track on the inboard side of the hulls; widening would move the jib leads out too far, and I'd have to cut the jib back to sheet to beam mounted leads or find another way to mount inboard leads. I had been planning on making some wings which kind of make the boat bigger, and wouldn't have as many things to change as a result.
There are a few factors that make it hard for me to decide on what route to go. After I got the boat, I heard about the race to Alaska, and I would like to do that in a few years from now. If I use the Dart, which I realize is ambitious, any improvements would help in that campaign. The Dart would only be big enough for a solo entry, but finding crew with the time and money for the venture would be tough, so I'm okay with the solo idea. If I get a bigger boat for Alaska, money spent now takes away from that budget.
I'm also getting pressure from the guys in F16's and 18's to get into that circuit with them. They see how I sail the Dart and they want me in the fleet. Of course, being 200 lbs, they don't want me as crew either though
A Florida boat, an Alaska boat and a regatta boat would be the best solution, if I had that sort of money, but I don't. I can see the adventure racing boat being good for 2 out of the 3. As for regattas, unless I find a super deal, I'll have to continue bringing a knife to the gun fight.
Users on-line
- 0 users
This list is based on users active over the last 60 minutes.