WA looking to try a 21
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Posted: Aug 22, 2021 - 11:54 PM
I'm considering buying a 21 se project boat. I'm OK on skill to sail and fix, but I'm wondering if anyone in WA or OR needs crew or can take me out. Would like to see if trailer sailing is for me, set up, take down... Former dingy to big boat mono hull sailer looking for some better speed on our Puget Sound in light wind and flat water. Sport sailing for kicks. christo@bravoencore.com -
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Posted: Aug 23, 2021 - 05:49 AM
The H21SE is a beast to set up. Trailering legally, you need to collapse the crossbars. I need 4 people to expand and pin them. The mast stepping for the H21SE is considerably harder than the H18 or H16. I can step the H18 solo, same for the H16. On the H21SE I've used a winch with blocks near the cab of my truck. The last time we trailed to the keys it took almost as long to set up as it did to drive there. No Bueno. I did not collapse the crossbars either. It is just a bear to do.
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Todd Elozory
H18
H21SE
Hobie Mirage Tandem Island
Catalina 22
Thonotosassa, Florida
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Posted: Aug 23, 2021 - 08:39 AM
To Mr. Elozory's point - the boat is "all that" for comfort, speed and fun (I think), but requires a different approach to be manageable.
My approach has been all about mechanical advantage:
1) Gin Pole is a must along with a method to winch/hoist it up. While a bit of a pain to do at first, it saves HUGE time to just make a permanent gin pole onto your trailer. I think the A-frame approach would be best, though I like mine as well. Then a method for stabilizing the mast - a method for tying off the tramp lines is typical.
2) I don't collapse the boat; it is 9.5 feet wide and that's kind of pushing it, but cops have never given it a second look. Guess there's enough big boats being hauled around here that it's just another one, and everything else is in good/safe shape so they don't mess with it.
3) double or triple, pivoting rollers in the back re pretty much necessary and make loading and unloading much easier, though still not near as easy as say a H16 that you basically lift on.
My true set-up time is about 1 hour from trailer stop to ready to sail. With a seasoned hand we can get it done in about 45 minutes; (for me) no more complicated than a H18 - just bigger and heavier; but I don't collapse the hulls. Best tip for that, I've picked up is to just pull pins, collapse with trampoline on, then re-extend as far as you can and use ratcheting trailer load bars (the kind you stabilize loads with) to do the final stretch/tensioning/expanding to get pins back in.
I like mine and don't find it that bad to set up, though I'll likely go to something smaller/easier to set up eventually to get more sailing time in; I'd like to do Wednesday night races on my own boat but getting this one there and set up, ready to race by about 5:30 after work is "problematic". On the other hand, the 21SE is a blast/comfortable to take newbies out on; got my nephew and his wife out a couple of weeks ago and we were easily flying a hull with three on the wing in moderate/light air. Success was gauged by the "fun-screams".
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Chuck C
NACRA 500 Mk2
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Posted: Aug 23, 2021 - 11:28 AM
The trailer that comes with this 21SE isn't set up well. I expect to build the A frame, add rollers, and get all possible mechanical advantage. No beaches. It will all be off the trailer. And I have a good one ton for trailering . I can manage wide trailer loads. Maybe through this asking around phase I'll find one that isn't a project boat and more ready to go. I've been looking bigger, but finding a place to keep a wide cat or tri around here on the water isn't practical. Which has led me to the biggest possible trailering go fast platform I can find. Which currently looks like a 21SE. (I've glanced at a 25' class C). I'm going to see the 21 in a few days. I've thought about corsairs that fold up on trailers. Never sailed one though. Or set one up. I think an hour to get a 21SE to go isn't sounding too bad to me. -
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 06:11 PM
https://seattle.craigslis…inter-20/7369109402.html
Check out this inter 20 in Port Townsend. I don't know why he's selling it, but I know he put a ton of money and work setting it up for single hand cruising. I think it's probably a good deal.
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Dart 20
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 08:08 PM
Corsairs are great boats but they are a different experience that a beach cat. They are faster than monohulls but not as fast as beach cats. If you are trailering a Corsair and well prepped, you can have the mast up and sailing in about an hour working alone. Folks that do it a lot say it can be done in half that but I have not been able to do it that fast.
Based on your original post, a Corsair may be the better bet for you. Puget Sound has a lot of them and you would have a great support group with a ton of boat knowledge up there.
Don't get me wrong, I love my cats but if you are talking light wind and flat water, the tris are hard to beat.
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dk
Blade F-16
Hobie 14
Corsair F-242
Mirage 25 (Sold)
Hobie Tiger (Sold)
Hobie Tiger (Sold)
TomCat 6.2 (Sold)
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 09:18 PM
Boatbore, thanks for that lead in Pt Townsend. I'll be there for the wooden boat show and will arrange to see it. How would this nacra 20 compare for speed and person carrying capacity with the H21SE? -
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 09:43 PM
Dssaak, I do think I want the beach cat speed, but i appreciate the nod to the tri. It could be a better answer for me. Yet it doesn't sound any quicker to rig than the big cat. Why do you say it might be a better light wind answer? I would think a 20'+ beach cat would do better in light wind than the much heavier corsair tri. Wrong? If beech cats don't perform well in 5-10, and tris do, that would be useful to know. Because 5-10 is all summer long here on the Puget Sound. Winter is a different story. My most recent boat was a J35 and it did very well in light wind. Just too much work most of the time, and otherwise a more expensive hole in the water. -
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 10:06 PM
5-10, beachcats can do just fine and generally faster. Maybe about comfort?? Still, my 21 did very good for comfort when doing an all day regatta (redfish reach), when winds were way down... Full disclosure, though-you can get, repair or generally make all parts except the comptip/mast. Drop a mast on raising/stepping and you're done for a while. Unless you convert to a H18 mast...
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Chuck C
NACRA 500 Mk2
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 10:11 PM
They are different generations. They stopped building the h21se in1990, they started building the nacra in 1998.
I don't know the hobie but this nacra is well sorted, easier setup, and a carbon fiber mast you can step solo without a gin pole. I'm sure someone else here can comment weight capacity but I would think it's similar.
This boat has a great story behind it and I'm kinda surprised it's for sale. If you're interested you should reach out to the owner, nice person and experienced sailor.
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Dart 20
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Posted: Aug 24, 2021 - 10:44 PM
C'mon .. beach cat at 5mph? I am not sure I would use fine. At least on the tri you can throw up the 570 sq ft of spinnaker or the 245 sq ft of screacher and take advantage of what wind there is ... solo.
My buddy's H21 didn't have that big ass spinnaker. Can you sail that solo?
You should check out NWMA and the F-Boat/Corsair forum. I know there are a lot of tris in your area and getting a ride should be pretty easy.
I have a tri, a monohull and too many cats (if you ask my wife). I won't give up any because they all fit different types of sailing and wind conditions. I always advocate for a fleet rather than a boat.
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dk
Blade F-16
Hobie 14
Corsair F-242
Mirage 25 (Sold)
Hobie Tiger (Sold)
Hobie Tiger (Sold)
TomCat 6.2 (Sold)
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Posted: Sep 04, 2021 - 09:38 PM
I bought the Nacra 20. Nice boat and well cared for. Looking forward to getting going on it before the serious fall weather sets in. Any WA sailers around? -
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Posted: Sep 05, 2021 - 12:23 PM
Sweet!!
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dk
Blade F-16
Hobie 14
Corsair F-242
Mirage 25 (Sold)
Hobie Tiger (Sold)
Hobie Tiger (Sold)
TomCat 6.2 (Sold)
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Posted: Sep 06, 2021 - 01:10 PM
Well there were three in my town until YOU came around
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Congratulations on your new boat, I think you got a good one.
This boat was set up for extensive cruising in the San Juans so it's ready for year round adventure
Now sail the #%*& out of it and be an inspiration to others.
The Bore
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Dart 20
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