I think mine had the same setup as you are describing. The threaded rod does not have to turn in the barrel it’s anchored into.
Undo both top & bottom nuts. (They will turn opposite way to loosen). Then hold the “flat spot” Andrew alluded to, I use a crescent wrench, & turn only the barrel, via a thin pin punch in the barrel hole.
We used an awl a few times, but twist it firmly in, & be aware they can break.
Heat the barrel with a propane torch, just enough so the heat load doesn’t fully transfer into the threaded part of the wire.
If all fails, (you should probably source new standing rigging anyway), cut them off
Thus photo is from an album I made showing the complex line rigging for the jib, but you can see the Diamond wire anchors.
https://www.thebeachcats.…070&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Newbie - Did I waste $1700? Mast kink on Mystere 6.0
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Posted: Sep 29, 2021 - 10:47 PM
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Posted: Sep 30, 2021 - 04:23 PM
Looking at your photo of the half removed panel, I see what looks like chips from the tool the po used to open the deck as far as he thought necessary to do the repairs. He did some patching, got discouraged with the results and abandoned the project. Time passes and he’s lost all interest in the boat and puts it up for sale.
Now it's your project. You have to decide if you can do the repairs with the access you have or do you need more room to do it right. The hardest part of getting the deck off is the first couple inches. He did that with very little damage to the panel. It can be done. Sharpen up a scrapper and give it a try. If you damage the hull side it's easy to reinforce it from the inside with some fiberglass and resin, the deck is a little harder to repair. It's very important that the scrapper you use is sharp. Knife edge, not blunt.
Word! Get pb blaster, kroil, or automatic transmission fluid and acetone mixed together and hit every fastener on the boat, repeatedly. When reassembling coat mated surfaces with lanocote or tefgel.
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Dart 20
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Posted: Sep 30, 2021 - 04:30 PM
Yeah you need all new standing rigging if you haven't heard yet. Say hello to Murray's for me.
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Dart 20
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Posted: Oct 01, 2021 - 11:10 AM
Murray's doesn't have premade rigging for a Mystere 6.0 but if I measure what I have, I assume they can remake it? The shroads appear in pretty good shape. Should I replace these for good measure anyways?
I was able to get it off and take a look at the bare mast. The bend is still there but when we put it up on to some table gravity brought the mast back to straight so it should be fixable right?
There are two things I'm trying to figure out in the hulls. I have gone around with a spackle knife, hammer, and razor blade to get the panel off but I can't get the panel off past this point. It seems to be glued down or fastened around the centerboard cutout. I have gotten the knife under the edge almost everywhere else but this is as far as I can take it off.
Lastly, as I have been looking in the front of the starboard hull, I can see some light coming through the base so this will HAVE to get patched. I assume fiberglass to reenfore the weak areas and cover any hole is the right proceedure here? Should I also look at re-covering the outside with gel coat or filler? You can't see the gaps in this shot but I wanted to show the space I will need to work in.
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Posted: Oct 01, 2021 - 01:34 PM
YES
you should replace all old standing rigging diamond wires, side stays. bridal wires and forestay or find a local rigger, there are lots of options here.
This looks bad to me, you have a bend and a twist. Where are you located? If this was me, I would have a professional rigger do a marine inspection on it. If that isn't an option, have your uncle evaluate. IF just a little weight in one spot corrects everything - you have nothing to do = you will have 100's and 100's of lbs of rigging tention as soon as you rig it and sheet in. that will auto fix a small bend - as i said - it looks worser than that to me but your pics are pretty hard to see a kink 20' away in low res pics and i am not a professional marine inspector
Some light is not a big deal, there are thin areas
IF they are worn down, through the gel-coat into any fiber - yup need to fix that.
you need to do some research here
i highly recommend the west marine video tutorials for an understanding of what a fiberglass/ epoxy work is gonna take
others will chime in too i am sure
Edited by MN3 on Oct 01, 2021 - 01:37 PM. -
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Posted: Oct 01, 2021 - 01:45 PM
Does "nothing to do" mean good to go or "nothing to do" as in there is nothing I can do about it and it is trash?
Edited by jgregs on Oct 01, 2021 - 02:49 PM. -
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Posted: Oct 01, 2021 - 02:36 PM
I read that as you are good to go. The force to straighten it is roughly zero, the forces on the rigging will be large. But, I can also read MN3's reply as doom and gloom.
My only sailboat work has been on our H16. So I'm not a rigger. I've done a lot of work with aluminum on aircraft. From what I can see, and if it was my boat, I'd probably try and tweak it straight and true with the wires off.
I did replace the mast on my H16. Not because I had to, but because I bought a parts boat for hulls. It had a better mast hound, no cracks for the stepping hinge, and later I found out the halyard sheave was much better. So that is always an option too - look for a mast.
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Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
Supercat 17, unknown year. Future project
Hobie 16, 1977 - died a spectacular death https://youtu.be/Y7O22bp2MVA
Hobie 16, 1978 - current boat
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Posted: Oct 01, 2021 - 02:41 PM
a little bend in a mast, not under load MAY be fine under load. when everything is sheeted tight and the mast has force on it, it doesnt impact the integrity and would cost time and money to "chase" making it look straight on land
IF a bend, kink, twist, corrosion, or other is in a location or with a level of severity that compromises the mast under-load, you need professional help. Hopefully you can find a marine welder/fabricator/rigger to do any
the cost of the work could quickly pass the value of a replacement mast (est $1000 to source a new/used mast give or take)
Edited by MN3 on Oct 02, 2021 - 10:25 AM. -
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Posted: Oct 02, 2021 - 10:17 AM
been thinking about this pic
I see an issue - you are missing all your bulkheads
you should see a bulkhead about 2' forward of the deck port and there should be a horizontal one too creating an inclosed box under that deck port. there is another bulkhead missing forward of that too - I can see where it used to be
if you recall i mentioned earlier that it's a known issue for the bulkheads to fail - my 5.5 forward bulkheads were fractured and looked like they were hit by lightning. Lots of flex and torque going on in these hulls
if you get the deck lids off - it's not that hard of a fix assuming time, money and skills are available
You can see the 2 bulkheads in this pic of my 5.5 (note the 5.5 does not come with the horizontal bulkhead)
If I am correct, these are the bulkheads you may need to recreate - this is when i was adding horizontal bulkheads to add extra stiffness to my 5.5 since i was in there replacing bow tangs
Edited by MN3 on Oct 02, 2021 - 10:39 AM. -
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Posted: Oct 02, 2021 - 02:41 PM
I think you might have meant west systems, not west marine. https://www.westsystem.com/instruction-manuals/
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Dart 20
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Posted: Oct 03, 2021 - 08:07 AM
yup. the bulk head fell down as I was getting the panel off. and the picture was taken just in front of the second one. I bought some fiberglass and resin which I will use to reenforce and attach them. -
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Posted: Oct 07, 2021 - 12:31 PM
So I have gotten the entire deck up EXCEPT right where it connects to the front of the Centerboard well. Looks like the PO put a bunch of glue in beneath where the top panel wraps down into the opening. I can't get a scraper or chisel down there. Any suggestions for getting that up? My first thought was try and use a long bar and come up from the bottom but I haven't tried it yet.
I was talking to someone and they said to just cut the thing with a dremel and repair the fiberglass which seemed extreme but is a better alternative than missing something and having the hull fill with water. -
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Posted: Oct 07, 2021 - 11:04 PM
We don't know what kind of adhesive was used, however Marine Debond formula will go through very tough adhesives like 3M-5200 with time. It won't dissolve epoxy or resin bonds. It might be worth spraying it into the adhesive and see if it softens.
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Tom
NACRA 5.7 (1984 Sail 181)
Pennsylvania
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Posted: Oct 08, 2021 - 01:51 AM
Look closely at mn3's photo of his boat with the deck off. It looks like there's a big wad of resin at the place I think you're talking about. I think you've arrived at the hardest part where you're most likely to break the deck. I like your idea of a long bar (sharpened of course) coming up from the bottom. You have to make your own tools and try to make the cut where the glue meets the inner surface, that's its weakest point. It's easier to reinforce inside the hull than repair the deck.
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Dart 20
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Posted: Oct 14, 2021 - 11:51 AM
Your mast bend to totally fixable....I have straightened the mast thru leverage with fixed points and bending slowwwwlyyy...! Then get another small section of mast that fits your profile...cut small section ...then rivet it on top of the bend....it works...
Did this on my 24 ft seawind...after rigger said it was not fixable...! -
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Posted: Oct 21, 2021 - 01:01 PM
Thanks for all of the input. I'm trying not to get overwhelmed with repairs at the moment but instead do one small project at a time. At the moment, I'm trying to focus on the hulls since those can't be replaced. Where I am currently is:
1) Still struggling to get the starboard top panel off around the centerboard housing.
2) There are several small cracks and hole on the bottom of the hull which was was going to repair with Bondo Fiber on the outside to fill the hole and add a layer of new fiberglass to the bottom to reenforce and ensure a good seal.
3) Refasten the bulkheads which have fallen down. -
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Posted: Oct 21, 2021 - 08:06 PM
SUCCESS!!!! After multiple sessions just trying to get that panel off success is mine! I was able to get it off and inspect the hull. GOOD NEWS! Everything appears to be waterfast. No holes, punctures, or anything that would let water in (that I saw). Some of the bulk heads have to get fixed since they are being help up by a hope and prayer but thats easy enough.
What I'm curious about is some places that seemed "thin". They have no give or flex but the light I shown underneath them was visible (on the bottom of the hull). I was thinking I will put a layer of fiberglass on the inside to add thickness but then sand and use fiberglass filler (Bondo Glass) to smooth out some patchy repairs the original owner did on the outside.
Thoughts on this approach? Or would it be better to let sleeping dogs lie? It is sealed and waterfast to the best of my knowledge -
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Posted: Oct 22, 2021 - 09:59 AM
great job. I would be more concerned about areas between the bulkheads/stringers and the hull. Look for any cracking or separating. Remember, the hull without gelcoat is translucent. If the gelcoat has worn off, you will see "daylight" and be perfectly fine. Take a look at the outside and see if there are layers worn down. You can easily add a layer of glass or two if there is a concern. Lay it up, sand, paint/gelocat, and sail. keep it simple.
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Scott
Prindle Fleet 2
TCDYC
Prindle 18-2 Mod "FrankenKitty"
Tornado Classic "Fast Furniture"
Prindle 19 "Mr. Wiggly"
Nacra 5.8 "De ja vu"
Nacra 5.0
Nacra 5.8
Tornadoes (Reg White)
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Posted: Oct 22, 2021 - 10:42 AM
Nothing like that around the centerboard slot or the bulk heads. The bulkheads are loose so I'm going to resecure those.
There are some deep scratches on the bottom of the hull that I believe can be filled with fiberglass filler and sanded down. -
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Posted: Oct 22, 2021 - 09:54 PM
My H18 shows light through the very bottom, & it has no wear.
If you do decide to add a strip, go to Johnstown Distributers, or any fibreglass supply place & buy a roll of 2” tape.
It has formed edges, so you can lay it down just like masking tape, and not have hairs & uneven edges. It’s really easy to do on the inside, just thinly paint some epoxy along the bottom, (dried & wiped with acetone), then thinly wet out the tape. You can loop it, like drywall tape, put it inside the hull, stretch it out, then “paint” along its length to push it onto the hull & remove any bubbles.
You don’t have to worry about drips & runs, & no sanding or finishing is required.
Edited by Edchris177 on Oct 22, 2021 - 10:01 PM.
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
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