How much would you spend on vendors who support you?

First job out of college was selling sporting goods and team uniforms to high schools and colleges... great job.

Had one client that would always ask for a sizable donation to support the program, but always took his business to a dealer that was Northern CA to save a few bucks. After two years of this I polity told him to pound sand and that unless he supported us we couldn’t support him. He made a big stink about this to the Athletic Director and was telling the other coaches not to buy from us because of that. They really didn't care what he said anyway because they knew what kind of a weasel he was. One year I get a call from him, the dealer dropped the ball (pun) and couldn't deliver the game uniforms in time for picture day and the kids were real upset because they were buying the jerseys. Even though we had the cut and sew plant local and could deliver the stuff and have made me a shinning star I chose not to do it, and I let him know that. Eventually the AD got with me and asked me to help him out after getting some heat from the parents which we did and at a discounted price!

The next year I got all the business from this individual not because of this, but because the company he was buying from went out of business by being a Me-Too- Price- Buster.

Support you local business or those that are supporting your (insert activity) if you can! They may be a little more; and that is a hard pill to swallow in these economic times, but in the long run it is a better proposition.

I know I didn't spend much time in College, but would my signature be considered

racist

too? Or is it ok to bash on a white boy? Is it ok if I have a bunch of white friends?
Mark Schnider...I wasn't talking about the law but I wouldn't expect you to understand that anyway.

Not really. White people in government housing isn't such a high rate (I'm hypothesizing..haven't looked this up) that a

racist

would consider it an intrinsic characteristic of people with white skin...so it doesn't have the same kind of bite. However, on the other hand, the perception is that a significant percentage of government housing is occupied by african americans and to infer that the this is because of the color of their skin IS racist.

Are you saying that you don't think the previously discussed statement was racist?

Actually I DO think it is racist but my somewhat stealth point was the double standards we see today so often.

Ya beat me to it Lee.

How did this go from

would you support your vendors?

to Political Anarchy...

FWIW, I do my best as a vendor to support sailing events. I can't support them all, but I try to spread it around from NA and Worlds Champs (monos and multi's) to regional Opti and Junior programs (probably more so on the youth side than adult events).

If I looked at the dollars involved, there's no way I get an ROI, but it's just my part of giving back and helping to grow the sport.

-M

Hence my recent purchase of Zhik products... The new hareness realy is easy on the JUNK!

Thanks for your hel by the way!

Is it OK to bash a white boy?... ... Hey you can bash me all you want..... we are on equal footing and we have the same stature and power in society.

Now... change your tag line to

Texas Redneck George Bush

... and you have established the power disparity between Rednecks and

Regular civilized

people and that is offensive (but not

racist

in American discourse)

Try

That Hawaiian Barack Husein Obama is debating that Mormon Mitt Romney in a few months followed by that Cuban Marco Rubio who will battle that Catholic Joe Biden.

This is a racial and stereotyped characterization that communicates in a particular way..... (mostly about the writer)!

On the offensive scale.... where does it rank??? Mildly offensive?
Consider if I changed Hawaiian to the usual Muslim mis- characterization of Obama.

Now you ring the very offensive racist bell in the American culture because in American history... the black muslims of the 60's were anti american anarchist/ radical blah blah blah....(a powerless minority of a minority that you can demonize) and of course the idea is to dog whistle to your fellow travelers that Obama is a black racist anti American socialist traitor, potential terroist and illegitimate president.

Your idea that there is

a double standard

in this game of slurs is a fig leaf for you that tries to minimize or excuse the first slur..... these slurs are just ignorant descriptions of power relationships in American culture.

Why we tolerated them for so long is not an excuse. Props to Jake for pointing out something I have overlooked forever and bacho for deleting his tag line.

If these were my forums...

I'd create, and move all political drivel to a politic topic section. I'd also narrow it down to 7 or or forum topics.

If this were done, CatSailor could kick the butt of the sailing forum world, as it once did.

I'm down with free speech, obviously, but I'd like to have topics compartmentalized and categorized so that we can find the information that we're looking for.

I also don't like my swearing censored. If I want to call Karl a jack butt... <img src="<>/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin" height="15" width="15" />

Dealer support...meh. <img src="<>/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin" height="15" width="15" />

If these were my forums, I would put Jake in control of them.

+1
Rolf, what is stopping you from exercising your moderating super powers?

One of the things I like about Sailing Anarchy is the lack of moderation. You really have to piss in someone's Wheaties to get a thread or post edited. I uses to be on a woodworking forum, and virtually every thread had been modified. That bullshlt gets old rather quickly.

There is no censoring here, just a Napoleon Complex by a few posters..

Tony,
Rolf does not moderate this specific board ..

There is a difference between tossing offensive points of view and boorish or disagreeable points of view.

The F16's got their panties in a bunch and decided to moderate their forum to stop what they saw as boorish and disagreeable behavior that they felt injured their class image .... end result... very short sighted...the chilling effect was noticeable. nobody pays much attention any longer. Moreover, if they tossed a handful of posts since then ... I would be stunned.
Not much good comes from trying to regulate speech that is on the topic.

However, moderating offensive speech and deleting or sending it to the political thread is more in the lines of housekeeping.... I think of it as pulling weeds.

moderating the personal attacks of one participant on the other is a grey area... (Sam vs Wouter) (Wouter vs WF) (Wouter vs Bill Roberts) (Macca vs the F16 crowd)

When the attacks just become personal... eg... the classic

JANE... YOU IGNORANT SLUT

not much positive happens. I don't believe any of those posts were tossed... The participants basically quit.

Not much good comes about when people quit or when the moderator has to step in and stop the crap!

Self regulation is the best solution. Props again to Bacho for deleting his tag line.

The F16's got their panties in a bunch and decided to moderate their forum to stop what they saw as boorish and disagreeable behavior that they felt injured their class image .... end result... very short sighted...the chilling effect was noticeable. nobody pays much attention any longer. Moreover, if they tossed a handful of posts since then ... I would be stunned.
Not much good comes from trying to regulate speech that is on the topic.

The F16 class is doing just fine, despite the best efforts of people like you!

I miss Mary!

This forum, like any forum has

house rules

. IIRC, the

house rule

on politics was expressed by Mary a while back. It was

sailors talking to sailors about politics

and therefore OK.

But Jeremy is right. Politics and sailing are mixed categories and therefore trouble. I vote to nix the political threads. It's sailing...

As far as purchasing goes, I buy from good dealers and spend a little more. But I price shop if dealers sell junk and don't ship things in a timely manner.

Regarding racism. Whether for it or against it, anyone who uses the word

racism

is racist. Civility is a better word.

Not true. I had a post deleted that had quotes from a thieving vendor.

I wonder what Jeremy's view on this would be... <img src="<>/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin" height="15" width="15" />

I shop the best service. If that means that I pay 10% more, then absolutely. I will always give a local vendor the opportunity to earn my business, but in the end, if the service isn't there, then I have a hard time returning. In the specific case of local sponsorship you presented, then the same rules apply, and I'll certainly give them a run and see how they do, but if they don't provide the service, I have a hard time returning.

No comment. <img src="<>/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin" height="15" width="15" />

That's some hypocritical,spun ,bullshite, that makes YOU look racist. Just because you think you're being righteous doesn't mean you're not being racist. Trying to justify it with hypothetical percentages and stats is weak ,at best.

So if this( or ,say inmate statistics) turns out to be fact instead of perception, how the F*** is it racist to point out a statistical fact. Are you really so scared you are going to hurt someone's feelings or piss someone off that you'll ignore those facts while refusing to ignore all of bacho's posts ?

And in the end isn't that exactly what libs do best.

Jake, I'm glad we don't talk politics when we see each other, it would seriously cut in to some good drinking and boat talk time.

Todd, give me a freakin' break. You think turning it around is a

liberal thing

? Seriously? If that's so, it's because you guys make it so darn easy. Try this; Why aren't you the

bigger man

here and hush here as Lee recommended when he didn't agree with what I said? That piss you off? It did me.

In the post you quoted, all I did was provide a logical (and actual) definition of racism pointing out why Lee's reverse example wasn't really racist. It wasn't a racist statement because the majority of people in government housing probably aren't white. I didn't look up the statistics so I quoted

perception

. Which is really what racism is based on anyway. Are you really worried that I used

perception

instead of fact? Does that really bother you?

Nope, I'm not really bothered by any of this except the oversensitivity. My point is if you find statistics saying any race is disproportionately represented in a situation (public housing, prisons, etc.) , you seem to think that it's racist if that is pointed out. Yet, in the same situation but the term white being used , you're OK with that. It's the same thing and should be treated the same.Personally ,I think everyone should HTFU and not be so overly sensitive. I'm definitely not defending racism, it exists and sucks , but this ain't a case of it. The current pres. is open game as was everyone before it as shown in one of Schneider's posts above. Are you going to stand up for Mitt Romney when the Mormon jokes start?

No, I think the reason is spin and subterfuge are all you've got. Facts don't seem to help your case.

I haven't quoted one statistic. I talked about perception.

Let me spell it out a different way. The statement in question

Obama is just another black man in government housing

is racist. It is racist because

...just another black man...

plays on the perception that African Americans make up a significant portion of people that partake of government provided housing and it infers that it is due to their skin color (

just another

). This is racist. It is not me trying to make anything of, or for, myself. This is not me

spinning

anything...in fact, if you look up the definition of

racism

, you'll see that this fits within the definition and that the counter example does not because it's not as common for white people to be in government housing. I also haven't brought politics or political persuasion into this.

This is the only fact that I've discussed...and I'm not sure how it doesn't help my case. It's pretty clear.

Would you say that it is a

distinctive cultural characteristic

that white people are in government housing? It is not. This is why the posted counter statement is not racist.

You haven't pissed me off, I'm not sure you could.
I'm not defending racism ( It has affected me far more than you'll ever know), just thought your reaction, in multiple threads to 1 persons sig line was over the top. You stated how you felt, which you should, and then felt compelled to bully him in other threads until he dropped. That's my point.
So, I'll correct the word choice of my other example by saying- You're OK with religious bigotry, just not racism.

Todd

What are you doing?..

I thought you would get the hint...
Hillbilly... Cultural bigotry.
Polish or Cuban jokes... Ethnic bigotry.
Mormon or Catholic..... Religious bigotry.

THEN WE DRAW A BRIGHT LINE.... on the bigotry that involves race..... (hint... its the genes)

Jake is not approving or condoning any of this crap... he just highlighted the line....Racist things that are way over the top. It sounds like you want to muddy the line. Why?

I got it... you don't like Obama's politics... take it to the drill baby drill politics.... don't blur the lines

First, I try to buy locally, hopefully a shop that I can actually visit and see the merchandise and develop a relationship with the owner. Second, I buy from those that are associated with the brand boat that I sail in order tohave support from the manufacturer. After that, price.....

You're not making sense. This is the only thread I posted about it and it remains here. I responded only once directly to the person with the signature and then I only responded to those that addressed me directly. Now you complain about me continuing this thread but it was dead until you revived it again addressing me directly...and this continued discussion is somehow my fault? Typical.

When did religious bigotry enter the picture? I've never discussed that here. Now you are just inventing stuff trying to muddy the water.

Typical of what? Independent voters, White men in their 40s, Christians, Blue collar workers,... What are you trying to say Jake? That sounded a bit bigoted. <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />
The religous bigotry came up when you said my Mitt/Mormon question wasn't the same as the Black man stuff.Try to keep up.

I'm done, I've got to go to work to help pay for our presidents housing, rather he deserves it or not.