Painting Gaphics/images on Sails

high quality, good work in Vinyl(?)
You can find him on this site.

David Mosley
www.seacats.org

Most graphics on mylar main and jib sails are high quality vinyl. Spinnakers and dacron sails are usually painted on (although success can be had with vinyl on relatively fresh dacron sails). I'm not sure what kind of airbrush paint they use.

Thanks guys, My sails are Dacron, and I have an airbrush from some other projects, so if I can find out what kind of paint to use, I think I'll give it a try. Brian

Jake,

Can you give me a ballpark idea of the cost (per sq ft)?

It depends a lot on the capabilities of the equipment being used but in my case I can cut in one piece that would fit in a 13.5" X 96" rectangle. If any parts lay outside of that rectangle It would have to be cut it in overlapping panels. Prices can be all over the place depending on complexity of the design and multiple colors. A one color graphic, up to 13.5" tall, and of medium complexity, would run roughly $5 to $7 per foot. If you can fit two graphics in that 13.5" height, the price wouldn't change much.

The following graphic (which is on my boat) would probably be about $40 per graphic (high complexity with the frazzled text, three colors, and the fade). My friend in that picture owns a highly respected sign shop in Cleveland, OH and with their 3D routing system is carving up a 3D 'Willy' (the dolphin on my bow)for a ground ornament or to stick somewhere on the RV - pretty cool stuff. It's amazing how much technology goes into sign making today.

P.S. Always make sure you are getting the premium vinyl for boat applications. A lot of places will cut the corner and use a 5 year intermediate vinyl film. The difference is both the adhesive used and the thickness of the vinyl. A thicker vinyl has a better chance of catching on something and/or trapping water underneath. I always use an 8 or 9 year vinyl. It's a good deal more expensive but you can count on it to last.

I highly recommend Jake. The graphics he cut for me were top notch... my only complaint is that he wouldn't drive the 3 hours up the road to put them on my boat for me

Jake,

Are the vinyl graphics for sails made from the same material used on hulls?

I doubt it. The vinyl being applied to the hulls would be quite a rigid type, the vinyl applied to the sails would be a more flexible type probaly more often used on PVC banners and such. This is so you can roll your sail up and the vinyl wont crack/delaminate.

If I wanted something on my sails i'd screenprint it on myself, or me or a mate would airbrush it on. I've had a look at my sail and its dacron, I have inks that would last as long as the sail would likely last.

Because of the nature of the abuse a sail gets (bashed by wind, salt water, rolled up after use) I'd imagine a vinyl label/graphic to last no longer than 2 years applied to a sail.

Though I did get some dacron with an adhesive backer from a sail-loft down the road to patch a couple of what looks like cigarette burns in my sail. I noticed that my sail # must be produced from the same stuff, and it has no signs of wear and tear.

And I imagine it is possible someone has a digital printer that can print onto this substrate (Dacron with adhesive backer) which can be applied to a sail that should last years!. I think my boat was made in 1983, I imagine the sail is original as well, so that sail # has been there 20 years using the adhesive backed Dacron.

I've got a set of x-Worrell sails (Key Sailing 1) that was probably from what? 1997 or 98? With the sailing the guy before me and that I've done I figure these sails have well over 2000 miles on them. I don't baby them either (because their shape is terrible). However, all the graphics on the mylar main and the dacron jib are still in fine shape. Since the jib advertises for another graphics company (other than mine!) I tried to remove it and it was such a pain in the butt that I left it. There's at least 5 years on these graphics and they're fine. Even my hull graphics (constructed of premium 9year outdoor vinyl) withstood my grinder/polisher and rubbing compound with no ill effects. The graphics were damaged when I got t-boned a couple of weeks ago by a H16 but he also took some gel-coat with him!

The vinyl used for both applications, hull or sail, should both be high quality (thinnest) vinyl. The rigidity and thickness of vinyl and respective durability and expense go hand in hand. On the sails you need the thinnest possible vinyl so it can accomodate the stitching and seams and the hulls need the thinnest possible so they will not trap water under a thick edge. Typically the higher quality vinyls with the highest quality adhesives are very, very thin (less than .05mm). Most banners, around here anyway, use cheaper thicker intermediate vinyl since the banner surface is very adhesive friendly and relatively smooth.

you never asked me to! (and you never know - that sounds like a great excuse to go sailing)!

Jake, how far is hartwell from you?

(I've got family I can stay with there)

about 35 - 45 minutes straight down I85 to Western Carolina Sail Club (exit 14). I sail there recreationally when I get a chance. That's one of the biggest parts of the lake except for the damn where Spring Fever is held (and it's only 8 miles up the lake with no overhead obstructions to that area too)

Hello,
to get graphics on dacron you can use many types of paint or textile inks. Most waterbased paints will eventually fall off.
i think a spray can would work. i know flock adhesive would be very permanent.

you can also use insignia sticky back material. cut out and apply.

for the record, high performance vinyl is generally 2 mil thick. intermediate vinyl is generally 3.2 mil .

hope this helps

2 mil is roughly .05mm

Jake: I'm going to be at Lake Hartwell for a family reunion over the 4th of july weekend. I've told my family that my boat is definitely going to make the trip.

I used premium vinal for the graphics on my sail and hulls... see attached photo.

No problem rolling the sail however might have doupts regarding it holding on a standard jib that may flog at times.... Self tacker, no problems.

dang...not a good weekend - I'll be in Chattanooga, TN.

that sucks.

How far are you from the coast then? I'm always going out there.

It takes the Sailing Shack about 5 hours to rumble down the freeway to get to Myrtle Beach and about 4 to Charleston. NC coast is a lot farther.

North/South Cat Dash, cash prizes and a good time. Come on down.

David Mosley
www.seacats.org

ps more info is on our website-go to calendar and follow link

and a small craft advisery for the whole weekend - WHOOOOO HOOOO!. (now I really wish my crew had sailed a little prior to this).

Does that mean H-16/G-Cat 5.0?

Well I hope it is a beam reach so we can just hang on tight and scream down the coast.
David
G-Force 21

Wish I could this weekend. Have prior sailing committments.

Dave,
I don't think that is going to happen.
According to Intellicast, the wind is going to be blowing northest, roughly parallel with the coast, maybe slightly offshore.
This could make for a serious sleighride downwind to the mark, but a hard beat upwind to the finish.
Local conditions could kick in and mix it all up.
Hopefully, it will be offshore enough to knock the waves down so we can go FAAAAST.
See ya there.

Thanks for the encouraging words, it will be fun either way. I remember doing the "Sun Fun Dash" in 1992(?) when it was the same way. We beat into the wind 12 miles towards Murrels Inlet. Seems like it took 2 hours or so to get there, then we turned the corner and were home in 20 minutes. We stood on the rudder castings of my 5.2 and white knuckled it back home. I cant remeber going faster or being more scared on any boat I've sailed to date. Oh those were the days.

David Mosley
www.seacats.org

I'd get lost.

Plus, $50 is hard to come by these days

Jake, Since my Dacron sails are four years old, I take it you don't think the vinyl would adhere well. Is that correct? If it won't, I'll keep trying to find out what kind of ink, or paint to use. I am also interested in hull graphics, and it sounds like you are the man to talk to about that! Are there any guidelines you can give me to come up with the graphics? Just the name of the boat, BLESSING. Perhaps two colors. Thanks, Brian

Oh yeah, I suppose that I should show off Jake's handywork....

Here's my boat.. I did the painting, he did the lettering.

Sounds strange to name your boat after one that sank...
Otherwise its a cool name, and it is a very cool lettering job.