Tradewinds venue change question

If playing these games is all you have to do today, nothing I can say will help.

Mike

Why take it that way Dave.... aside from your general dyspeptic reaction to all things US Sailing because they threw you out of the sandbox. (I assume for not playing well with others.)

Beach Access is a legit issue.... cats are different from dinghies that launch off trailers....

It is a real issue... and it is area that could use some attention. Getting information about how other municipalities manage things like insurance, and access could really help the local boots on the ground effort at maintaining water access...

there is no

Them

. It is by an large a volunteer organization. It is just part of the game... you need to support your fleet, class, club, regional organization, and national organization and do your part at each level (that means work)... otherwise... you get a half assed result.

Would a paper, sanctioned by the governing body of US Sailing help a local case for maintaining beach access... I think it would... Will your local reps win the case... who knows but you make your best case and work the problem.

Who should create such a document that speaks to issues of recreational and racing catamaran sailors??? hmmm.... probably not a Farr 40 sailor.

Back in the day... we did not work with the local sailing clubs and organizing authorities... We had little interaction with US Sailing, CBYRA, or any yacht club with property.
Sandy Point State Park used to have a very popular beach and launch site for catamrans, windsurfers and other small dinghies. CRAC would use the park for a couple of regattas a year and start the DTB and C100 from the park. A nor easter drove a rebuild of the park.... Somehow, the park admin found a volunteer who attempted to represent the beach cat world. They thought they would make the park much better for our use... That was their goal.. Those of us in the racing club world would use Sandy Point once or twice a year and we were off their radar screen of who to contact. By the time we figured out the plan we were too late to make any changes .. The volunteer was stunned to find out how poorly the rebuild had gone, how bad the plan was and since he had moved away in the two years the park area was closed for the rebuild.... there was no follow up .... Too late to fix the loss.

Since we were not part of the sailing community... they did not find us. The end result was completely unworkable for recreational sailors and not worth it for the cat racers... The park was abandoned to the Jet skiers.

Back in the day... the attitude was ... we don't need that stinking Yacht club and US Sailing mentality...

all we use are the Portsmouth ratings and that was it

. Those official sailing organizations are useless and besides... they hate us and don't like us..... Today... You carry that same torch.

The attitude back in the day was a loser... Your attitude is a loser now!

There are real costs.

I think this is an area that US Sailing can and should get involved. I would think they could come up with a form letter that would go to local .gov officials. Perhaps even a letter from a lawyer's office can be effective. Nothing scares locals more than the fear of litigation.

A properly worded letter that explains the benefits of sailing to the community. One that also carries a bit of stick with it. You know carrot and stick method.

That would be a nice service.

OK, let's take a step back. What is the actual reason the site was

lost?

Is this as simple as a one-time scheduling conflict, or is there more to the story?

A deeper question would be, how is this US Sailing's fault (since this is being used as a reason not to join)? Other than,

I'm an American, and it's always someone else's fault, especially if it's a governing body.

Mike

My comment was not about just the Tradewinds site being lost but about sites being lost everywhere. I guess what I see is a big group with money and a lot of members will be able to get more done than some local sailors going to a town meeting. We lost all access to Wrightsville beach years ago and did attend the meeting and said we would police the area, pay a fee and so on and still no joy. I live 5min from the beach and have not sailed here in 12 years and the last time was the Worrell and we sailed in from Miami.
The biking association I joined IMBA has mountain bike trails opening up everywhere with government support on government land. We have 2 parks in my town with another getting ready to open and my membership is only 30.00. If the mountain biking group can get government parks and grant money why can't the sailing group. US Sailing is the largest sailing organization and should be the one to get the ball rolling. One reason cat sailing is in decline is there is no where to launch unless you join a yacht club or find private land to launch. Oh and I don't think myself and most cat sailors are yacht club people.

The last 100 yards of day one Steeple Chase has killed many a' sailor...... (Anne's Beach)

How was the site lost? History, Founders Park was once a privately owned marina, motel, restaurant and bars. I started doing my seminars there in 1990 and we got along famously.
CABB wanted to start doing a yearly regatta and we introduced them to the venue and the Tradewinds was born.
Then came politics.
the area voted in a new village, to be ruled by themselves instead of the county, nee Islamorada, or Village of Islands (some say Village of Idiots). It was then the fun began.
The new mayor bought the facility to be a town park, and personally bought the adjoining property.
The regatta still managed just fine with the new regime, until they redesigned the beach, tore down the bar, etc. It was then we found it difficult to get to the beach.
Meanwhile, Chip and Barb Short bought the beach concession and figured out a way to get easements to the beach.
Meanwhile the politics has gotten more and more difficult thanks to the town BoD. The director of Founders Park is all for the regatta.

In your asking how we lost the venue, it was not anything the regatta did wrong. We were always orderly and left the place clean. We had good relationships with the park director and staff.

Yep, this is unfair to a perfectly good regatta, who did everything right, but got blindsided by the politicia.

Rick

Jumping on Ding's bandwagon ... isn't this the single biggest thing USSailing can do for the sport? Have a gazzillion dollar insurance rider that any club could use to supplement their policy?

I thought that was the burgee program?

I'm still trying to get over the shock of not having T-winds at Founders park. Did anyone tell that furry dude in the T-back and his hot wife we're not coming? He'll be crushed.

Can someone contact the bank that owns Rowell's and see if we can use it? Long shot, I know. Maybe we can all pitch in $50 and buy the thing outright... <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

Is MYC a possible host candidate? Having it in Biscayne Bay?

I like the three-day concept over MLK weekend, but agree that crashing the A-cat party would probably cause some bad feelings (those guys have fragile egos <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" /> ) and that's never good for the sport.

There is a burgee program provided by Gowrie.

Burgee program

Our yacht club uses it. It's not cheap though. It's just a program that US Sailing partnered with to provide insurance to yacht clubs. It works fairly well for a large established yacht club. However it is not really appropriate for a one weekend regatta.

Last I saw prices a weekend regatta coverage was around $1000. That's not really in the budget for a small regatta.

I'd really like to find out how Bike organizations handle this. They have group rides all the time that have to be covered. They have races. It would be interesting to see how they handle their coverage. I know someone locally that's very involved in the Trailnet program and will inquire about it. Perhaps they don't think the exposure is as large for a bike ride/race.

Rick, Did they request 1 million or 3 million in liability coverage? Or maybe more? Just wondering.

Operating a Community Sailing Center is a local effort. However, the support and recognition from US SAILING helps keep the program viable to the local City and Community.

See www.sailsandpoint.org

Caleb Tarleton, Sail Sand Point Board

Beach front property is valuable .. The owner wants to be named on the policy. You don't have a beach access problem... you have an

I don't wanna pay the going market rate problem

.

From what i remember, the distance races in Florida had a similar issue with liability coverage for the property owner....

You could form one organization, Incorporate so nobody has personal assets standing behind your insurance policy, buy the policy, write the registration checks to that organization and you can run regattas every weekend. Usually costs you 50 bucks to add a named landowner to the policy. (and it covers your liquor liability)

Mike, I don't know what the attorneys were asking of Chip and Barb.

I don't why everyone says we are crashing the ACat Party. They finish up on Friday and will be gone by Saturday morning. And the beach is huge and can easily accomodate an abundance of boats.

I retract my earlier statement then, I thought their final day was Saturday. But we'd be crashing their party on Friday since many show up for T-winds Thurs night and Fri morning..

I for one would be showing up at least on Thursday, and going out to practice on Friday, may even get there on Weds. and practice both Thurs. and Fri.

I'm sure the A cat guys won't mind if we just jump in for a couple of their starts...

Right?

;^)

Rick, have you talked to anyone about access into the water and boat storage? It's very small, also I've never seen them allow boats ON the beach in front of the hotel.Yes ,it's huge but I think it's off limits, better to find out now then let the first one that shows up handle it( Been there done that). For all the Tybees and A cat races I've done there, they keep you over to the side and the A's usually overfill that area.

Yep out front is off limits. It blocks the view of the water and the entry into the water is maybe 2 boats wide unless it has changed.

I have gotten into mountain bike racing and our club Sorba is a member of Imba which provides some insurance for the events. Some out of town events charge a $5 license for the weekend which provides insurance. This is my first year and I did win my class of masters with a best score of 6 races. It cost $25 to enter and I ended up after each race with something worth more than my entry and a $75 gift certificate at the end. Oh and a bonus of losing 25 lbs and set up is fast take bike off rack put on shoes and helmet and ride. I still like sailing but the travel, boats and fees are getting to costly for me to do a lot of events.

I have been talking to Dennis Green, who has the beach concession, for a year or two. Even while we were entrenched at Founders Park, I wanted to have a Plan B in case things went awry. Indeed they did.

Dennis has been encouraging the entire time.

I really do not see a complication -- we don't ALL have to use the ramp area at the same time, do we?

Most of the local access issues that I've seen are managed by local governments, maybe the state for the bigger beaches. We've had good luck over the years, but I am aware of one site in Newport that was shut down by a single

taxpayer

at a meeting.

US Sailing won't be sending lawyers to these meetings, so I'm not sure what else they can do.

Like it or not, there is more bang for their buck by supporting yacht clubs and community boating centers, who tend to have fixed venues and assets. This is where they seem to put the effort to increase access to sailing.

Maybe we need a sea change on our side; rather than pushing against the tide and burning out more people, work with the YCs and CBCs to get new access. We need to stop being so unrealistically cheap, as the days of truly free access are certainly gone and not coming back.

Mike

Too keep programs viable, you need to show benefit to the local people. Today, we had four H-16's from Sail Sand Point on the water for five hours, taking people out for free rides. This was part of the

Day on the Water

at Magnuson Park in Seattle. Providing public benefit is the key to keeping your place on the beach.

Talked to the Director of Founders and he is 100% for keeping it there, but there are a bunch of legal problems. He and I are still trying to see what can be done.

With regards to the ramp, the reality of Founders Park was a pretty narrow path to the water (usually one boat's worth) because of everyone setting up their boats at the water line. I see the two launch ramps at the islander with a deeper and wider boat setup area as an improvement. Spring Fever launches half of their boats down a long single-wide concrete boat ramp...it's pretty orderly and you don't have to wait too long there either.

Look at this on the other side of the coin, gentlemen.

I would gladly write a check every year for a considerable membership fee to an organization that would do nothing but work on securing and maintaining favorable beach access for sailing. How about you guys?

please note, this is not me soliciting for a job. I already have two...or three. I also do not have any expertise in what it would take to require beach access. However, I have a little disposable income and consider this would be a very worthwhile effort and would be glad to contribute something I do have available for it. This also isn't really me saying we need to start up a new organization. This is really me using a little sarcasm to try and point out the mistake it is to respond to a potential member of your organization, who has a valuable suggestion, with

sounds great, great suggestion, now do it yourself if you want it to happen...and, by the way, your dues are due

. Not everyone has the time or expertise (or enthusiasm) to make bigger things happen than we can do alone. This is a key reason we join organizations and associations. It's not for a discount at the feed trough...it's not for a magazine or a shiny membership card.

Definitely, and not feel like I was being extorted to do it.

Yes! And we could come up with a really catchy name too, something like...um...

US Sailing!

Oh crap...

How much?

If you guys will pay me a 6 pack of Sam Adams Imperial Stout per day, I will give you unlimited access to Lake Jackson out of my back yard.

Oh, and mast up storage on the beach too!

Maybe you should read my last post again. US Sailing does help with access, but in a different way than you're asking.

What's important is the water, not the beach; correct?

Mike

Generally speaking ... can't get to the water without crossing the beach.