DELRAY BEACH, FLORIDA 33444 We presently are allowed 60 spots for mast up storage $250 per year. There are 2 areas to launch beach cats one mile apart in Delray. There are also many SUP, kayakers and kite surfers using the same area, and we all get along.
Mike
Yes it does. So name in the last year, all the beach access sites you have gotten in Florida. It shouldn't be to hard, I mean with over 700 miles of coast, surely you can prove what everyone's dues went for. I know all the money stayed in Florida, and we are benefitting in so many ways.....so enlighten us. Name the city or county government, and location of launching sites that are presently under negoiations, and or obtained. Isn't there a saying somewhere,
if we build it, they will come.
Forrest I-20
I forgot to mention that quite a few years ago the city wanted to stop allowing us our beach access, at that time we were allowed 30 spots. The sailors and friends got together and fought city hall. The result was when we left we had 60 spots instead of 30. It can be done.
Mike
Yes it does. So name in the last year, all the beach access sites you have gotten in Florida. It shouldn't be to hard, I mean with over 700 miles of coast, surely you can prove what everyone's dues went for. I know all the money stayed in Florida, and we are benefitting in so many ways.....so enlighten us. Name the city or county government, and location of launching sites that are presently under negoiations, and or obtained. Isn't there a saying somewhere,
if we build it, they will come.
Forrest I-20
You need to re-read all of my prior posts, you clearly just don't get it, and aren't even trying...
EDIT: Hullflyer clearly gets it (THANK YOU!!!). Beach access is a local issue. US Sailing helps with other issues.
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David, seriously? Is your browser broken???
http:/
Be sure to click on Strategic Goals as well.
By “access” I believe they mean access to programs, not access to all the beaches in the country, which is why I recommended working with YCs or CBCs.
Hope this helps.
Mike
You need to re-read all of my prior posts, you clearly just don't get it, and aren't even trying...
EDIT: Hullflyer clearly gets it (THANK YOU!!!). Beach access is a local issue. US Sailing helps with other issues.
--------------------
David, seriously? Is your browser broken???
http:/
Be sure to click on Strategic Goals as well.
By “access” I believe they mean access to programs, not access to all the beaches in the country, which is why I recommended working with YCs or CBCs.
Hope this helps.
Mike
Mike, I'm not sure why you're attacking a guy who has been exceptionally cordial and only proposing an interesting comparison between sporting authorities. The point is, it doesn't have to be a local issue. US Sailing could take up the task to help people with local water access issues. Maybe it's building a document that helps people understand the general legal processes involved, a glossary of terms...perhaps, it's having some experts on tap that can provide advice. Maybe it's as advanced as having an advocate in several key states that can go to bat with the local guys.
David makes a good comparison in that mountain biking is a sport that carries as much, if not significantly more, risk for an organization or property owner than someone providing water access for us to launch boats on. How are they able to secure new parks and grow while our access is becoming more limited than ever? This is a good question. It doesn't seem to be reverted to just
a local problem
within their organization.
If nothing else, this could be another tangible benefit that US sailing can point to. This actually fits quite well with the linked strategic goals.
I think the mountain bike guys may have a bit easier time than the cat sailors, as they are looking for access to...the woods, and with the politicals, it's out of sight, out of mind, where the cats are looking for BEACH access...and you KNOW those same politicians also want to have access to the beaches, and don't want any 'stray cats' out there, running over little Johny, playing in the waves.
We may have better luck if we get together with the Surfer Dudes and the Kite Boarders on this, than with US Sailing.
I know when ever I come in to land at a public beach, lake or ocean, there always seems to be a bunch of kids around who, instead of moving out of the way, just stand there looking at you, coming at them! I always say to myself,
Just don't HIT anyone!
Can you imagine the lawsuit if you did injure some little kid while beaching your cat?
Mike
Thanks for the link sorry I did not take the time to look it up.
MISSION: Provide leadership, integrity and advancement for the sport of sailing.
VISION: Be the recognized leader in training and certification, in support for the racing sailor and in facilitating access to sailing.
After reading the Mission and Vision I could not help to think that providing sailboat access at public launches would fall into
facilitating access to sailing
If you don't have a place to launch your boat you can't sail. Wow US sailing spends a lot of money. I thought it was only volunteer there is even a pension plan. A lot of money goes to the Olympics which really does not cater to the masses (it could be donations). What does US sailing own that is worth around 500,000 (not exact number)? After reading the little I did I am more put off on US sailing and what they are doing with the money.
Tim
Aren't all beaches public up to the high water line? Yes it would probably be better to work with the surfers and kite boarders as they do have surf only areas at beaches.
I would say that most boaters have liability insurance and bikers don't as the bike is covered under your homeowners so I don't agree with your comparison. I would say there are plenty of lawsuits from bikers and that was why I brought this up about US sailing using there power in numbers to help like the IMBA has for mountain bikers. I am sorry I said anything now and I don't really think US sailing is something I want to be a part of, but I do support people that give there personal time to help sailing in general so thanks to all for your efforts and time.
Jake, I wasn't attacking anyone. It is irritating to constantly be asked what the benefits are, what the goals are, etc. when it's just as easy for people to go to the US Sailing site and look it up. Where do you think I go for the answers???
If you look back, you will see that I (and Mark and probably others) agree that the MHC can create a list of guidelines and best practices for those in local negotiations to use.
David, I respect your decision to not join, even though I think it is misguided.
Access to sailing
does NOT mean
access to the beach
and you most definitely can sail without access to a beach. I've given other options throughout the discussion.
Don't like the idea of going to a YC or CBC (me neither)? Do the legwork to make local access happen (that's what we do locally here).
Mike
Mike
I guess you are not reading my post. I am not just talking about beach access. I am talking about public ramp launch access to be cat friendly. I have said we have tried locally to get access and been denied. The yacht club does not have cat access and a long waiting list (most people join to get parking and beach access and don't even own sailboats). I don't expect US sailing to come in and change things in my local area and I expect that this is becoming common in other areas. Just saying getting cat access will help promote our sport every time an area closes I would guess we lose sailors. Wrightsville beach had over 100 boat regattas in the 80's and now you can't even keep a cat on the beach overnight unless it is on private property.
In my town there are a few boat ramps and even two spots to get the boat on the beach without a ramp. Problem is they don't allow you to park your trailer anywhere.
The boat ramps do have parking, at $15 per, and you have to dodge everyone when trying to step the mast. Oh, and one has power lines stretching across the ramp 15 feet up. oops.
Pete found a free launch spot or two in Hickory Bay, but it's pretty shallow, and a ramp.
Sanibel causeway is pretty good spot - $8 to get over the bridge, but gets you gulf access, lots of space and pretty beaches... Not sure if they'd allow overnight stuff if we had a multi-day regatta there...
Getting back to what started this, I think it was about paying for Insurance at Founder's Park, is that right? And US Sailing was going to sell them a policy for $1,000? Or more than that?
If 50 boats show up, that's $20 each, added to the entry fee.
Anyone got a problem with that? I think last year's entry fee was what, about $150? So this year it would be $170.
Or is there a lot more to it than that?
And if we use the Islander, I assume we are going to be sailing on the
outside
vs. in the bay, where we normal race, is that right?
Not really. CABB has always carried the insurance on the regatta through US Sailing. This has to do with the beach concessionairs and the village. Rumor has it that insurance could be a problem.
the concessionaires thing confuses me. Do they have to
host
the event?
What qualifies an entity (say CABB) to host their event at the park?
If 50 boats show up, that's $20 each, added to the entry fee.
Anyone got a problem with that? I think last year's entry fee was what, about $150? So this year it would be $170.
Or is there a lot more to it than that?
And if we use the Islander, I assume we are going to be sailing on the
outside
vs. in the bay, where we normal race, is that right?
With regards to the Islander, while you are sailing on the outside, it's still behind the reef. Its choppier than the sound behind Founders Park but it's not full on big waves or anything.
correct. Only a bit more seaweed and man-o-war.
Still beats any good day on a crappy frozen lake
IIRC there are also less shallow spots on the outside and a shorter sail to the course. Plus a closer walk to the tiki bar at days end.
What would the price difference be?
Haven't followed the entire thread, any thoughts to moving up to the Miami area? Would make for a shorter drive and easier logistics from the airport. I'm all for sailing in the keys but Biscany Bay is far from bad.
Timbo, I'm sure this is not what you meant, but before anyone lights their hair on fire; US Sailing isn't charging anyone ANY amount of money for insurance.
That would be the insurance company, and the discounted rate charged to the OA is a benefit of US Sailing.
Mike
Now I'm confused Mike.
So, the OA buys insurance from...who?
And then they get a US Sailing discount from that provider...why?
That would be the insurance company, and the discounted rate charged to the OA is a benefit of US Sailing.
Mike
Hate to burst your bubble but we quit using Chubb (US Sailing insurance provider) regatta insurance because it was too expensive and found a provider that gave the same coverage for less so the Chubb arrangement isn't really a benefit. Have ever noticed that Chubb never makes the cut when someone asks about insuring their boat? Why is that? Come on Mike I know you need to beat the US Sailing drum but now it's just starting to get ridiculous. Stop pimpin the stuff we can't use and start working on the things we need!
That would be the insurance company, and the discounted rate charged to the OA is a benefit of US Sailing.
Mike
Hate to burst your bubble but we quit using Chubb (US Sailing insurance provider) regatta insurance because it was too expensive and found a provider that gave the same coverage for less so the Chubb arrangement isn't really a benefit. Have ever noticed that Chubb never makes the cut when someone asks about insuring their boat? Why is that? Come on Mike I know you need to beat the US Sailing drum but now it's just starting to get ridiculous. Stop pimpin the stuff we can't use and start working on the things we need!
So Dave....are you saying that with the thousands of boats of members in USS, we can't get a better deal than just going on the internet and working our own deal? I thought there would be a discount because of volumn and or association with USS. Hmmm....and people pay dues for what? I even bet there are agents on this thread that would love to write the business and give a great discount for couple thousand sail boats.
Forrest I-20
I don't know about the regatta insurance but the US Sailing B,G&B boat coverage is pretty high with high deductibles and they only insure one design.Have heard they are good on claims though, and that means alot.
I wouldn't be surprised if the better deals can be had for larger, more valuable, boats for private insurance. That's probably where the negotiating leverage is between US Sailing and any insurance company.
This is almost amusing...
My point was that US Sailing is not running the insurance.
It's actually Gowrie, according to the website (again, why am I the only one who can find this?): http:/
I am not saying it's better or cheaper than anything else, just saying that there is a discount, and that is a benefit of membership. I'm constantly being asked what the benefits are, here's an obvious one. If you choose to use different insurance, that doesn't make it any less of a valid point that US Sailing partnered with this company to provide this as a benefit.
Mike
As best I know US Sailing's agency is also the only one that still provides insurance if you charter your boat. I'm also not sure who else provides insurance during racing, if you read the documentation, most policies exclude racing, although your particular agent might be more forgiving.
Still, boat insurance isn't regatta insurance. Why do we need the latter again? $20=more beer money.
My point was that US Sailing is not running the insurance.
It's actually Gowrie, according to the website (again, why am I the only one who can find this?): http:/
I am not saying it's better or cheaper than anything else, just saying that there is a discount, and that is a benefit of membership. I'm constantly being asked what the benefits are, here's an obvious one. If you choose to use different insurance, that doesn't make it any less of a valid point that US Sailing partnered with this company to provide this as a benefit.
Mike
What do you think B,G&B was in my post? Barton,Gowrie and Brett maybe? Geez.
In my mind a benefit is a savings, not a greater expense.
.... US Sailing partnered with this company to provide this as a benefit.
Mike
That would be analogous to saying that because my Cable provider offers HBO it's like a benefit to me ...
Wait, I don't watch HBO and if I did I'd have to pay extra for it ...
Is that really a benefit to me?
I already answered that. It's a benefit that you choose to leave on the table. This happens every day when people elect not to use employer-offered benefits.
Todd, someone else mentioned Chubb. Cost is only one part of the equation.
Follow the link above to see what is covered for clubs, types of boats covered (not just OD), etc.
Mike
Just for the record.
BACK IN THE DAY.... US Sailing did not have a partnership with any insurance companies. Regatta liability insurance was available through one underwriter. cost was about 350 for on the water and another 350 for beach/liquor liability. You had one option. Back then... States did not require your group to provide their own insurance... they covered it for you ... so... it was just 350 for on the water coverage... Times are tight.... they refuse to do that these days... if you want to use the state park... you need them to be named insured on a policy.
What you bought back then was coverage for the RC and its actions. If you borrowed your buddies power boat to run marks for you with your volunteers (they get hurt pulling up an anchor etc etc .... when it hit the fan.... It was your buddies insurance that covered any liability for his boats actions.... It wound up on HIS credit report etc etc. Some of us thought that was a big ask when you were borrowing a powerboat and getting a volunteer to run races.
US sailing worked with Gowrie and developed the burgee policy. Solved this problem. The other company soon matched many of the benefits.... ITS AMERICA... competition is good. You pick what you want or can afford... Just like you decide on how well off your insurance companies finances must be. (See AIG and bailout for the counter factual)... Is the value worth the cost... YMMV... THE POINT IS.... IT was US Sailing that sorted this out and gave us choice.
Back in the day.... your PRO, would volunteer to be the one responsible on the RC and take on all of the liability.... He basically trusted the host club to cover his butt ests.... (versus his home owners policy...) (You can imagine how those conversations worked out between host club and pro with regard to liability coverage... HUH!!!! WTF who needs this BS).... SO... US Sailing decided to purchase liability coverage for their PRO's who pass their certification and stay current with the continuing ed of being a PRO...
You may have noticed the liability coverage requirements for the A class and the F18 worlds coming up in the next two months... You may have noticed that MANY of the owners are in a scramble to purchase the proper amount of coverage and CAN'T from their underwriter. .... News flash... these requirements are WORLD WIDE and have been in place for some time.
Back in the day....you had the sailors on Olympic campaigns who needed world wide coverage. Boat US writes a lot of policies but did not want to touch Olympic sailing campaign requirements. ... Nowadays...the current OD program uses those World Wide liability limits... (HMMM... I wonder how that happened.)
When you race overseas...and bring your boat... the OD policy covers you.... Moreover, the Olympic guys will frequently charter a spare boat from their training partner... News flash... YOU have to get your own liability coverage. Usually for each country you might race in in the EU.. So... US Sailing took what one of the teams had worked out... expanded on the RFP to include you loaning your boat to another plus chartering your boat and your charters, PLUS coach boat insurance... (yep... to be on the race course within 300 yards of the racing... you have to carry a million bucks of coverage plus some other requirements for the driver) with that underwriter.
This OD coverage was just for the Olympic classes... and now the underwriter had made it the one design insurance policy that you now see. Don't plan on doing the Worlds in the US or abroad .... there are cheaper policies. YMMV.
Bottom line. that is the record... whether it is worth it to you is your call.
(he he... maybe we should ask the Obama passed Consumer Protection Board to take a look at boat insurance policies out there and generate the single sheet simple form so you know what you are buying... many people seem confused by the choices in the marketplace)