Where do new cat sailors come from?

Eh? Front page, down on the left under Special Sites is Sailing Seminars. Unfortunately, my summer is already booked.
http://www.catsailor.com/sailingseminars/ss.html

In the UK Brian Phipps runs the (very successful) Windsport Cat Clinic.

Windsport Website

There are others around the country and several clubs have RYA Multihull Coaches among their members.

Hi Berny,

Agree with most of what you say.....

There is a core group of dedicated Club Sailors and core group of roming Regatta sailors, with a few that commit to both.

Something I have been considering in the future (post Worlds) at our club.

I live on the Atlantic coast. In its heyday in the late '70s the beaches here were prolific with Hobies, Nacras and Prindles. Then came the Jetski. The older guys kept sailing and the younger ones got personal watercraft. Gas and go...why wait for mother nature? The cat sailors in our fleet are mostly in their 50s and 60s now but still going strong, many with their same boats from the 80s. Beach cats were almost a fad here in the 70's and, of course, fads tend to fade. We still try to engage young folks but young people today are a whole new breed with seemingly limitless technology and a lot more choices. I can't tell you how many times I've watched a kite surfer and thought.... if only they had that fifteen years ago.

I can agree with you that there are few younger people who are really into cat sailing let alone sailing in general. Well, at least in my neck of the woods there are very few kids my age who sail beach cats. I wasnt around in the 70's to know if cat sailing was big then, but I know that now, it really has the potential to become a big thing. All that is needed is for someone to start promoting it through the media more, being that today's world runs on the media.

I believe that sailing in general is still going strong. At the club I sail at in Tampa, there was a

school's out

regatta a couple weekends ago. There were a 100+ opti's on the water plus dozens of 420's and Lasers. That is a lot of kids getting into sailing. The question is how do we get these kids onto cats.

From personal experience… I got into catamarans because someone took me out on one when I was young. I have taken people out on my boat and they have decided to get their own afterwards.

Take them out on a windy day. They will either love it or be scared off, but they will see the speed. Then, when they want their own boat offer to teach them for free.

I took some people out in 10 kts, and flying a hull while the other boats were just bobbing seemed to convince them that catsailing was the ticket....

I don't think the manufacturers are doing much to promote cat sailing either. I live in a large metropolitan area with lots of water. You couldn't walk down the beach in the '70s without tripping over a H14 or H16. Now we don't even have a Hobie dealer. I sail a H16 and a P18, both 1982, but I wouldn't know where to go to buy a new one. Lots of boats around here are kluged together from old parts. After a Nor'easter we comb the beaches looking for stuff to recycle. <img src=

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I sail a stingray at Kingston SE South Australia in a cat and windsurfer club with my four kids. They showed an interest in sailing so I bought them a 420 which gives them ownership and commitment but after the adrenalin of a screaming reach on the cat and rescue boat proving that breakages are manageable its a battle to get the 420 in the water. The downside is the kids need your attention so I start at 8am race day and by the time the race starts Im buggered with waterlogged hulls, but at least they all get their turn.I have no shortage of crew my problem is I cant use them in scary weather so I am looking at self tacking jib setups to solo in the weather that has them looking longingly at the clubroom. My best memory of 2005-2006 race season is my eight year old daughter laying flat on her back on the tramp with her feet planted on the lee hull pulling the jib on with all her might, it should be a bit tighter but I leave it there. Its winter here and they keep asking when does sailing start. So I guess my answer to your problem is finding the time to devote the attention and praise the kids need.

If I see someone really watch me as I sail I offer a ride. I try to take at least 6 newbies out a season. So far this year I have lead to 4 people getting boat, not including grand daughter (Mystere 4.3). I started her at 7, she is 12 now, with 2 years trap time and now learn stick and spinnaker. We must do everything we can to grow the sport, as it will NEVER be like the early 80's with I started.

Doug and Ashleigh Snell
Hobie 17 #007
Sunfish
Soon to be Mystere 4.3 # 149

This from the Austrailian Hobie website

QLD Hobie assoc is staging a youth H16 training day Sat Jun24 and a one day Youth H16 regatta Sat Aug 12, both at Mooloolaba.
Each team will be allocated an experienced Hobie sailor as coach/mentor. The training day will involve land-based tuning and coaching as well as time on the water with the coach. The Saturday regatta, sponsored by Hogsbreath Cafe will involve short sprint races for H16 and H16 spi divisions Cost is $nil for the training day and $20.00 for the regatta.
All participants must be financial members of the Queensland Hobie Cat Association.
Notice Of Race for Regatta will be available soon.
Thanks to the many QLD Hobie assoc members who have volunteered their services to assist our new youth members.
Contact h16youth@sunstatehobie.com.au to register for more information

It's interesting to read that the majority of cat sailors in some areas are older. I can attest that sailors in general around here are older. I don't know any cat sailors here but I see a couple on the lake now and then.
The earlier point about PWCs replacing cats wholesale makes a lot of sense, ski boats probably contribute also. I think access and storage is also a problem. On a recent trip back to my old stomping grounds on Barnegat Bay, NJ, I saw that the place I kept my Tornado was now off-limits to cats. It used to cost $10 a year to keep a cat there, now it can't be had at any price.
In the FL Keys last March I was hoping to take my wife out on a cat since she'd never been on one. I went through every boat and toy rental company in the yellow pages and could not find a single place to rent one. Plenty of jet skis though. Very disappointing.
At any rate, if the price of gas keeps going up we may see new sailors coming out of the woodwork.
Regards,
Matt

I sail off the beach in SC. In the early 80's people were always asking for a ride. Then the beach service starting giving rides for money. There were 20 boats on the beach in Windyhill alone. Now there are 2 boats on the beach. No one ever asks for a ride. I believe the cat companies missed the boat by not latching on to the extreme sports craze. We all know that strong wind in the ocean is totally extreme. Maybe the children of this generation are just too lazy for sailing, or biking, or surfing. Hell, most of them don't even play outside. Video games are a large part of this. I know guys in their 20's that will play Tiger Woods video golf all day, and bet against each other. Ask them too go to the course and really play golf and they are not interested, don't even own clubs.

Our last group outing we had six or seven boats out and all but two or three had people under 20 on them. A couple of weeks before that, I took one of my daughters out with my niece (13) and nephew (12). My nephew knows how to surf and sailboard, but it looked like hanging out on the trap trumped them both.

Me, I'm a monohull convert. I took my first sail on a cat at age 45 and the only way I'll go back is to a New Haven sharpie.

Yea, I remember my first regatta at Wrightsville Beach, NC in 1980 (over 200 boats). Now they ban boats from that beach. I've seen the decline, but think there is potenial to grow. Some media exposure with events like the VolvoExtreme40 and Tybee500 would help. We need to start actively promoting Cat sailing to high school and college kids.
There has been a movement of new Cat sailors from the NC State Sailing Club thanks to Trey and Tad (Velocity Sail Team). They've brought 3-5 boats to several area events. I think colleges and college sail clubs could be a great target for new Cat Sailors. They provide a pool of Thrill Seeking kids that would love to crew. They are also at the age where they will have disposable income in a few years. I bought a used H16 before I bought a car when I got out of college. Mainly because I got the opportunity to start crewing for a friend when I was 18.

I think it is unfair to say people are lazy or uninterested. I learned only because I happened to meet someone at work who sailed. Since I have started to learn I have talked to my friends about how much fun I am having. They are all interested, but honestly, I usually have to explain to them what a catamaran is. Some say 'after you learn take me!' Some think I have evidently lost my mind.
I really think the problem is more a lack of awareness among the non-sailing community.

I can agree with the Wendy, when I take my friends from school sailing with me, they have absolutely no prior knowledge of sailing in general, let alone cat sailing. After we finish with our trip though, they have clearly had a great time and later beg to come again. I think that more awareness would definetly get more youth my age into cat sailing. Maybe a presentation or something of the sort at a local HS or college as Mark noted would get more people interested.

Personally, I feel that unless you offer something in return to someone who is uninterested in a sport or activity, they will have no interest in the activity whatsoever. Perhaps a free ride on a beachcat one day or a free

learn to sail

lesson or something of that sort will

up the ante

a bit for youth to want to come out and learn to sail.

I think it would be cool if you could incorporate it into your normal regatta. Maybe start an hour earlier on Saturday to have a trial race. Have each skipper take a newby or two on their boat. Have one start with all classes and take a run around the course. You would need to have them sign a waiver to sail. Then, Maybe have someone do a seminar for them afterwards on the beach while they've started the regular races. This way they could hang around and have some idea of what is going on on the water and then participate in any after race parties, etc. You could promote it at area Colleges with a Flyer the weeks before or get in touch with the school's sailing club if they have one.

Some interesting discussion.
It seems that as I suspected, cat sailing world wide is only moving along slowly and it would appear that there is not a lot of effort being made to promote it. There's plenty that could be done but it seems there's a shortage of dedicated people to do the work. It's usually left to volunteers to do the organising but it's always difficult to get people to put their hand up as it's often a thankless and time consuming job.

I too think that the established manufacturers have much to answer for. I know sales are down and the profit margins are small but there seems to be plenty of money to put new boats on the market (F18/F16/Extreme 40, more and more cruising designs etc) but it's very short sighted to leave the very crucial recruitment of potential users to amateurs. Just my 2c worth.

Last year our local cat fleet(The SEACATS) hosted an

Adopt a Monohuller

day at the local sailing club where a few of us sail from. We took a few of the guys out, and everyone had a good time. No one converted, but they at least have a better appreciation of speed. My next venture will be to organize a racing series, start with Sunfish the first race, maybe Laser the 2nd, then Hobie 16 the last race. Run it round robin style, and maybe have heat races like the Alter Cup. Maybe this will peak some interest, and bring out the monohull boys.

Here's how you get new sailors

From our forum

[color:

red

]It was so exciting watching the awesome starts from the committee boat. You guys are really aggresive and have excellent timing. 2 new lady skippers out last night!!! Marie with Darcy on the front and Bev with Pappy on the front (where was harness?) 2 girls age 10 & 11 racing with their Dads. 1 youth back on the scene kicking butt watch out for Matt Perkins and the other Youth Sam Ingam with Dad on the front. 12 hobie 16's and 1 Tiger completed 3 races in 8-12 with dark skies. Bullets by Adam & Scooter, Micheal & ?, Tom & Erika. Thanks to my crack RC team of Diane, Rakel, Mimi and Perk

[color:

blue

]It was a GREAT night!

Learned much, have much to learn, had a BALL!

Speaking of which...

Pappy did have his harness on, just couldn't c it under the coat - he become MUCH MORE COMFORTABLE after he trapped - felt better driving with him on the wire as well.

Thanks very much to Mike Spondello for the generous use of his boat - Luv u Mikey <img src=

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Pat - I will take you up on your offer to go out and practice tacks, general sailing. First learn to sail - then learn to race. <img src=

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What a wonderful bunch of folks we have in 204 - very proud and happy to be a part of such a great family <img src=

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B <img src=

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[color:

red

]B said it for me. Wonderful folks we have in 204, very proud to be a part of a great family. OOOOXXXX to all for your help and support.

Many new skippers, ladies with sticks in their hands and lots of ute sailors!!!

Keep the faith ~/) ~/) ~/) <img src=

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Folks you are confusing two issues.

How to get people into cat sailing is very different from how to get them into cat racing. (of course it’s a chicken and egg proposition but you need to focus on the two separately)

Cat sailing is a recreational activity or past time that falls under the umbrella called boating. Access to this unique form of recreational boating is through resorts and the local hobie dealer selling boats like Hobie Wave. Escape, and Bravo line of boats. What these folks want are good cheap reliable boats that don’t need much maintenance and are turn key so that you are recreating quickly. You can go cat sailing by yourself and back in the hey day… many of these boaters populated the public beaches…mostly with their family and friends. Why did they stop sailing?… where did they go? … probably has many answers but it’s likely that some moved up to monohulls or the F boat trimarans…. Others just got tired of the activity and moved on to a new challenge when the boat got old or kids limited their ability to get on the water.

What’s important to realize here is that NO ORGANIZATION is needed or really wanted by these folks. They are just like the huge number of recreational sailors with their boats in a marina… few belong to any local organization. If they want anything organized… it’s centered around a social outing… So,… groups like Singles on Sailboats, or the Catalina owners group arrange a cruise to X for the weekend and now their fun solo activity is also social and more fun. In the catamaran world… a few places come to mind where these sailors congregate. Sandy Hook Catamaran Club has over a hundred boats on the beach and the vast majority are pleasure sailors…. The club provides a beach parking spot and a social group of sailors if they want it. A club near Chicago with cheap beach space parking that apparently never turns over and most of the sailors come down to recreationally sail a few times a year…. If the price went up… or they had to move their boats once a year (yacht clubs frequently insist that the boat move out of the club once a year so that they weed out those owners who don’t want to participate in the club activities) The facility might disappear. On the Chesapeake… Hobie cat’s are scattered on small bits of private property, or in commercial marina’s…. Cat Sailing is an individual pastime that you share with family and a few friends.

So, the question is…. WHO should be marketing and enrolling people in this activity? What should they be doing? Who is their target?
Seems to me… this is the boat dealers responsibility or perhaps US Sailing’s responsibility. All of these answers are a bit fuzzy to me. I personally don’t want to build or support a social club.

I can’t think of any leaders in the US catamaran sailing scene who take on this job of running a catamaran social club? Anyone have any nominations… Perhaps the Learn to sail guys with the Hobie 101 program in Oregon??? Or Jeff Rabidaux.??? Who is trying to revive a social hobie fleet in the midwest. Maybe the Sandy Hook guys. Those people could speak up and tell us what’s needed to make this kind of thing happen and what it takes to draw in social catamaran sailors into a club OR and how do they help the local dealer sell boats. In my experience… the racing sailors are not interested in this initiative and so counting on us to pull this off will be a waiting for Godot scene

Cat Racing is a sport!
Those of us who are organizing and running clubs are interested in creating an organization that is fun to be in and is focused on excellence in cat racing. Many of the clubs include this in the name… CRAC… CRAM.... OCRA. …. Those R’s stand for racing!
So… when you ask the question… how do you get more people involved into this activity…. The answers will be very different. If you don’t have a group of people racing…. You have a pretty lame race.

Who should be marketing this activity?
The answer is VERY CLEAR… it should be and is marketed by the Racing catamaran clubs, the Racing Class Association, and the builders and dealers of racing boats. How well we do this is of course open to debate.

What should we be doing?
Again the answers are easy… check out the thread “what makes a great regatta?”
The answers, are run great regattas with a great venue, great race committee, great competition, and less important are the social activities and food. Truly great events manage all of the above.
Long term growth and health are addressed continually by classes. US Sailing organizes a yearly meeting (One design Class Association symposium) where all of the classes discuss ideas on how to deliver quality racing that meets the needs of their members. Check out my reports on the Annapolis One design forum and attend the one in your area when it comes around. For a recent success story check out the growth of the A class…. How many people would have expected that an expensive single handed boat would be the fastest growing class in the USA?

Who should you market to?

This gets to be interesting…. Because it frequently looks like AND IS a zero sum game.
You rob from one class in order to build your own favorite class.
Hell.. Hobie threw out all of the open boats because they decided that the sailors were looking at the newer non hobie boats… and choosing those boats and not the Hobie’s…. No net growth… just a loss on their side of the ledger… in their mind.
Sailing clubs are also very protective of their existing classes….Any new class will cut into the participation in an existing class… So… no new classes!
Nevertheless… some classes grow (A cats) and some die off (Nacra 6.0’s). mind you these boats have second lives with the recreational sailors.

Catamaran clubs look at all of the rail meet on the mono’s and say… Damn…. Some of those boys ought to be on a racing beach cat…. So… we are starting to do the big monohull races… Annapolis to St Michaels and three or 4 others on the bay, the three Distance races in California…. The Miami to Key Largo race… Around Newport race?
The idea is that if you pass them to weather on the first lap and to leeward the second time… they will get the idea that fast is fun. We need better ideas on how to introduce those guys to the performance catamaran.

What else can you do?

Simply STEAL THEIR KIDS HEARTS!
CRAC, Fleet 54 and Hobie Div 11 along with the Miles River Yacht Club are running a junior Hobie 16 regatta this summer. The Div 11 junior sailors get to go race at a top tier yacht club with pool, great facilities (and a Tiki bar for their parents). What’s new and exciting is that we are also LOANING boats to the CBYRA 420 and Laser racing junior sailors for the weekend regatta. We have US Sailing insurance for the borrowed boats and the idea is to introduce the SPORT of CAT RACING to RACING JR SAILORS.

So, this is what CRAC is about…. What’s your clubs initiative?

See Tom's post about how Fleet 204 is going about it. They try the low key racing approach with lots of kids on the water for weeknight sailing.

West River Catamaran Racing Assn on the chesapeake uses the single 3-4 mile tuesday night race to get people going rather then lots of intense mark roundings on the weekends.

What else do people do? What's your focus?

Mark, et al,
we seem to get all sorts of people into sailing, racing or otherwise. It seem that we get both racers and non racers showing up at our events. (Races or other events) This is evidenced by the large numbers of people on hand to help with flags, launching boats etc.

Frankly, we can't seem to slow our growth down. every season we see new folks on the water. Some stick around and some move on.

I think the key to this is having a central meeting and sailing venue, Which we are very fortunate to have. We also promte learn to sail days and are present at local boat shows also. Our core group of more experienced sailors are quite approachable to new sailors, almost to a fault.

And yes the racing is very important to allo of this, BUT, while it is fun to win, the important issue is getting out on the water with your friends and your potential new friends and participating.

Off to Spray Beach to race with my 10 yr old

Point High & foot fast!!!!!

Tom

It all goes back to the local people volunteering and taking part. Click on Schedule at http://www.div4.hobieclass.com/ for some of our results in the Northwest, the pictures show the results. It is not all about racing, but we have that too. Alter Cup Area H Qualifier this weekend at Skamokawa, WA. Also see www.sailsandpoint.org Local community sailing groups must step up to make it happen. US SAILING and other groups can make recommendations, but it is up to the local sailors to make it happen.
Caleb Tarleton, Sail Sand Point, Hobie Cat Fleet 95, Div.4, and US SAILING, Multihull Council.

I am a

new

H16 crew/sailor - I got into it because someone who cared, ASKED. Just like everyone else in the local fleet, they all care about the growth of the SPORT, the great times shared in RECREATIONAL SAILING, and the desire to see the class stay around and be enjoyed by ALL.

I can't tell enough people about it! I look forward to learning more and more about sailing in general, and now that I am starting to skipper, I will be learning to RACE.

We have very approachable folks who are willing to teach, encourage and assist whenever possible. Sometimes, at the cost of doing well in an event.

Can't wait to get my own boat (next summer??? That's the goal), introduce my kids, my sister, and friends to it - This is a

sport

to be enjoyed for a LIFETIME...and to be passed on enthusiastically <img src=

alt=

/>:):)

Thought these might interest you.

http://www.floridamultihullsailor.com/web/jpor2006web/JPORstory_p1.htm

GREAT pic!

Very good article - Haven't been in FL sailing much - Went in January, Tradewinds - Sailed on a Tiger...Had plenty of boats.

Sailed this past weekend at Spray Beach - In a bay, not really open ocean. PLENTY of wind, however. Rich McVeigh gave a nice recap...

http://www.fleet204.com/204um/ShowMessage.asp?ID=4208

BTW - The attached pic is NOT from this past wknd - its from Spring Fever / Easter Weekend

I remember that very well.....except from behind <img src=

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/>. You guys were fast at Spring Fever.