Mary suggested a new post instead of getting way off in the ditch, so here goes.
Timbo wrote-
Mary, why aren't there more Opti age kids sailing Waves? I remember when the Wave first came out, they took it to an Opti regatta, put some kids on it, two at a time, they LOVED it, loved the speed, loved all the room and having a friend with them! I expected it would eventually replace the Opti as a great kid training boat. And what happened to that Fast is Fun US Sailing Multihill program?
Also, could the Wave be fitted with a single trap or would the mast not take the load?
Edited by Timbo (02/20/06 04:04 PM)
A quick search found these stats on pricing
Price Range:
* New: Under $3000 (US), complete and ready to sail. A new Optimist may also be home built (savings and/or additional costs vary in direct proportion to the skill levels of the builder).
* Used: $200 - $1,000 (US), dependent on condition.
and there's been over 350,000 built.
I've often thought H14's supplemented with Waves may work? I know of only one club with (5-6) Waves and one dealer that loans Waves for Youth day/Friday at Hobie regattas. Tough to compete with, based on cost alone. What can we do?
Money is usually the answer. There is a local youth sailing group that has been active for probably 40 years. I think the core of their fund raising has to do with donated boats. People who donate can take a tax dedcution for more than they could probably sell the boat for. The club in turn sells the boats which are 100% profit.
You might try that.
Opti sailing is one part sailing, one part baby sitting. Parents get kids into Opti's to teach them to sail, but its also about giving them something to do, keep them entertained, and let them enjoy the water for a couple of hours. Opti's dont go very far, or very fast, so its easy to keep an eye on a bunch of kids in boats. Its the YC parents that want the kids out of their hair for a couple of hours, and its what they started in, so they have to put their kids in it.
If you gave them waves, they'd be all over the place in no time.
I can think of 10 boats better than the opti for learning to sail - sunfish, tanzer16, 12',14' or 16'catboat, etc
My daughter is going to learn to sail on one of these
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My daughter is going to learn to sail on one of these
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Great boat!
I've seen combined fleets of 300 Optis, some kids as young as 8. Are you sure you want to see them all ove the place?
I had been teaching a kids Opti program back in 1994-1996, my own twin daughters were in the program and being one of the few Dads that knew how to sail, I got involved. My daughters were quite board most of the time, due to two things I think. Lack of speed and lack of another kid in the boat. The boys in the program took to it much better than most of the girls. The boys wanted to race, where as the girls just wanted to socialize, for the most part. I wish they had Waves back then, might have kept my girls sailing and away from horses! After several years they dropped out of sailing and went deep into horses. That was 10 years ago, I'm still paying for that mistake!
My kids do like trapeezing on the cats now, but not so much racing, just getting out on the wire and going fast.
I have a Hobie 14 for my youger two kids, but it is so hard to tack they don't use it often. The Wave is easier, isn't it? Yes, I taught them to gybe instead! 
Timbo,
Good point. "keep them away from horses" that Arey's Pond Catboat just became cost justified. Thank you.
I'd really like to get her sailing in something that she can be comfortable in and enjoy at age 4. And something that the wife will approve of.
Bill
Timbo:
What I have learned form my 17, going from a sloop to a uni, is you must let out 3-4 feet of sheet as you go head to wind are you will go into irons. Not sure about a 14, but it should be the same.
Doug
Bill:
I just sent a email clip that should get your 4 yr old interested in a cat.
Doug
The 14, having no boards to pivot around, tends to stall out head to wind if there is any wind/waves at all, unless you are going well, close hauled, do everything right and of course, let out some sheet and bear off to get it going on the new tack.
Doing all that while also trying to pass the hiking stick around the back of the blocks is pretty tough for a kid, and they usually get it stuck in irons. Better to gybe!
Timbo:
Also teach them to roll tack, that should help too.
Doug
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Wow, Mom! Nice boat for a beginner!
If you live near Stuart/Port St. Lucie, FL you might want to lookup Eric Arens. He's selling catboats, now.
My kids do like trapeezing on the cats now, but not so much racing, just getting out on the wire and going fast.
I have a Hobie 14 for my youger two kids, but it is so hard to tack they don't use it often. The Wave is easier, isn't it? Yes, I taught them to gybe instead!
My experience with my youngest daughter was in the opposite direction. She was into horses when we were on the Mainland but wanted to learn how to sail once we moved to Maui. I was between cats so I joined the Lahaina YC so she could enter the juniors program. They use Optimists. They're moored in front of the club from May until November. We have a storage shed but it's about a mile away and it's hard to move the boats back and forth.
The YC has about 450 members but there's only about ten that are active sailors. Guess who got recruited to teach?
There's also four Lasers that the advanced kids use out of the Mala launch ramp. We're trying to get enough interest and build up skills so the kids can compete against the Oahu YCs.
I'd love to get some Waves but we're limited on storage space and I don't think they'd last very long if they were moored for extended periods of time. Besides, I'm a voice in the wilderness when it comes to multihulls.
Well, we use both at Sail Sand Point. See www.sailsandpoint.org. Dan, in our picture has been to sail camps at Sail Sand Point the past three years. He has also sailed Opti's. It really helped him to learn to sail on the Opti. The Opti was more responsive, and less forgiving, hence he learned faster. The Wave in light wind is very easy to sail, and frankly too easy for them to sail. Our five Waves are used in the crusing sail camps, but we also mix in FJ's and Club 420's, rotating the kids each day. It gives them a better chance to experience more boats. In our Open Sailing, the Hobie Wave is the most popular boat, with both kids and adults.
As you will note from previous messages, all five Waves were donated to SSP by our local Cat sailors, and other groups.
The Wave is a great boat, but kids need to solo on an Opti also to get a better feel for sailing.
Caleb Tarleton
When we had a learn-to-sail program, we found that it is much easier for adults, too, to learn on monohulls than on multihulls, for the same reasons. Our instructor used a Flying Scot.
We don't have Waves over here, but we do use Optis and Toppers for our Club Youth Training. I also have a Hobie Twixxy that I can take along on training days, but we have found that kids need to learn (and learn quicker) in small monos. A lot of UK Training Centres have Laser Funboats but the kids just don't learn anything by using them - in fact I consider them to be a pile of s**t that are downright dangerous and more likely to put kids off rather than get them into sailing.
The way we now structure our training (for adults and kids) is dinghies and then they get a few outings in the Twixxy and from there it's crewing or get their own boat (mono or multi) with the opportunity of further help and training if they want it.
I've always found that beginners from dinghies progress quicker than beginners from multis, especially when it comes to race training.