I have a little differant opinion , I bought a cherry 19 Prindle with all the go fast sails and this is more fun then a riding a greased bull
My way of looking at it was to buy it and take my time learning the characteristics of that boat and always have enough in the way of performance in the bank so as time goes on it will always test me.
I love this boat and find it is a much more forgiving boat than some of the others because of its size.
I can say at this point that I will not get bored with this boat and that was a concern when I was looking at smaller Hobies and Nacras.
I have already hoisted from the deck and successfully flown the shoot solo a few times and loved every minute of it, one thing to practice is always keep the mainsheet in your hand and 99% of the time you can get out of trouble.
So that is my two cents worth !!!!
GO BIG OR STAY AT HOME !
I am still a relative newbie (4 yrs), sailed monohulls since '79, but for what it is worth, the ad indicates "newer wheels" I am assuming beach wheels. These are great for several reasons. When setting up once the mast is up, you can roll the boat around to face the wind for installing sails without fighting the wind. Secondly, it will make breaking down at days end much easier, and also on those days when you don't get in until low tide, you won't damage your hulls getting the boat to the trailer. I have been lucky to sail with a great group of people. We watch out for each other, look over each others boats for possible missed problems, etc. As a newbie to cats, sailing with knowledgeable people, will greatly hasten your learing curve. Not that you will need to keep up with them, but you will learn from the things they do without thinking of mentioning it to you. I would suggest beach launch. I also agree with the mentioned jib furler. A Hobie type furler can be installed without needing to cut your sails, and it is a great way to depower, as going out in up to 10 mph winds, don't mean you will not get caught out in 20+. I have done this with my P18-2. If it don't already have a 6;1 up haul on the rudders, this is something I would recommend, and I am willing to walk you through. Best Wishes!
the newer wheels refer to the trailer, not to the beach (cat trax?) wheels....
I spoke to a few more local sailors the last few days, a couple of them also somewhat familiar with cats and Prindle/Hobies/Nacras...the consensus is going smaller for a beginner maybe 16ft, mostly b/c of the learning curve. Then also scanning the ad market the price does seem a bit high, it's worth around 1500-1800 the condition it is in and depending on how much the buyer is looking for a larger Prindle. It's definitely nothing to brag about cosmetically and I am looking at it as a starter boat that would get me through a season or maybe two before I look for a nicer boat. So ideally I wouldn't want to spend a lot of money to keep it up during that time. I could also store a 16ft in my driveway while a 19ft with 30ft mast means expensive off site storage and I would be somewhat limited in performing maintenance. B/c of family and job access having the boat close to my place to do any maintenance on it is definitely a factor...
Well, after a lot of humming and hawing (did anyone notice???) i ended buying the boat i fell in love with today. We spent half a day going through set up and sailing the boat in fairly light winds in Mission Bay. Nice warm weather and i hopefully will remember most of it when i try to rig the boat in the drive way the next few days. Anyway, thanks to everyone for posting comments and feedback, everyone's angle is very useful. In the end there was some kind of mutual attraction with the boat and me and so i just followed my heart....i'lll post a pics and experiences as things come along and probably will have a lot more questions to follow up with...
Marek
In the end there was some kind of mutual attraction with the boat and me
how can you tell when a boat is attracted to you?
Congrats!
lets see some pics when you rig it again
MN3 wrote: how can you tell when a boat is attracted to you?
Answer: The battens stiffen up.
if I can find a way to practice rigging dry during the week, I should be able to take the P19 back to MB next weekend for a sail and take a few pics. I will have a very good sailor with me so I am not too worried about the sailing part mostly concerned with the rigging right now... Any particular technical sections anyone can recommend are appreciated. Also, we rigged the boat loosely on the trailer and only tightened the stays after the main was up. Apparently, raising the main after tensioning the stays is very difficult. Also, getting main and jib to clip into the O-rings was a bit of a challenge, so there's definitely some work carved out for me just to set up the boat before actually sailing. Finally, I either have the option of launching it from the ramp and then beaching it next to the ramp to raise main and tension the rigging or launching from the beach (Fiesta island) trailering it into the water using the tow vehicle (no dolly/cat trax yet). If anyone is familiar with San Diego/MB/FiestaIsland and could comment, that would probably be very useful too.
getting main and jib to clip into the O-rings was a bit of a challenge,
those are tricky at first, even for seasoned cat sailors
Finally, I either have the option of launching it from the ramp and then beaching it next to the ramp to raise main and tension the rigging or launching from the beach (Fiesta island) trailering it into the water using the tow vehicle
best option (imho) is to step the mast on the trailer and back it down the ramp (mast up), get it to the beach and raise the sails there. check for powerlines at every ramp
if your in salt water - it's not the best for steel trailers, springs and any type of wheels/bearing but can be done in a pinch - i would hose it down asap
Edited by MN3 on Jan 06, 2014 - 11:33 AM.
"if your in salt water - it's not the best for steel trailers, springs and any type of wheels/bearing but can be done in a pinch - i would hose it down asap"
yeah, that part I know well since I already trailer a power boat...I recommend Boeing T9 spray - more expensive than regular anti-corrosives but well worth the money..
Unfortunately while the boat looks in good condition the trailer was not really taken care off too well, so that's the first thing on my list to do the next few days.
Edited by marekli on Jan 06, 2014 - 09:51 AM.
best option (imho) is to step the mast on the trailer and back it down the ramp (mast up), get it to the beach and raise the sails there. check for powerlines at every ramp
I agree just make sure you still have the boat tied to the trailer and the trailer hooked to the ball or things
could get interesting in a hurry.
there's tie down straps and then it's hooked to a winch, so I'd take down the straps before going to the ramp and then the winch hook when it's finally in the water ready to float it off to the beach right next to the launch ramp...at MB De Anza Cove if you launch it right next to the beach it's just a few steps in water to the beach...
Marek wrote: getting main and jib to clip into the O-rings was a bit of a challenge,
MN3 wrote: those are tricky at first, even for seasoned cat sailors
20 years of sailing and racing, thought I was fairly seasoned but have no idea of what either of you are talking about. The only "O-Rings" on the boat are around the inspection ports.
Maybe clevis ring?
thanks Nacra55, having weak memory for terminology and limited sailing experience, I descriptively used the term "O"-ring..... hopefully, that will change as time goes by and folks like you correct me.
i believe he is referring to :
The unique ring that prindles have (s-hook for the jib) and the standard ring and hook at top of the main halyard
20 years of sailing and racing, thought I was fairly seasoned but have no idea of what either of you are talking about. The only "O-Rings" on the boat are around the inspection ports.
Maybe clevis ring?
ok, thanks for the update MN3. Speaking of cotter pins and "O-rings"...there's a lot of pins and ring fasteners that I would like to replace with quick release type pins. Is this an option or just not reliable enough or maybe just in certain non-critical locations? If so, which ones would be ok to replace?
Edited by marekli on Jan 07, 2014 - 11:16 AM.
Marek, reference to the 2" SS rings on the main and jib. Make sure when you are first attaching the head of the jib to the forestay for hoisting, that the "opening" of the "S" hook on the jib halyard is "always" facing aft, towards the mast. This is true for all Prindles. This makes it much easier for the "S" hook to lock on to the 2" ring at the top. As far as the main, you probably already know that you have to rotate the mast in order to get the ring to lock as well as unlock the main. The P-19 is a great boat.
Morris
First Cat: Prindle 16 sail #5229
Second Cat: Prindle 16 sail #8647
Current ride: Prindle 19 sail #309
ok, so I have been out in Mission Bay a few times now and kind of got the "first pass" on the boat rigging and sailing including an "almost flip" while tacking in heavier wind yesterday (we got some GoPro footage on that too....lol). Luckily, we managed to right just about the last fraction of a second before we completely flipped over. Thanks again to davidsd who took me out the second time (first was the sale sea trial) and showed me a lot about how to rig the boat. Then also a couple of other experienced Prindle/Hobie owners that offered their help and spent some time talking things thru over the phone. I also purchased a righting bag for that time that hopefully, won't come up too soon.
There's a few things I need to do in the near future:
1. Replace the standing rigging (a few stays look like they have a couple of wires broken, after we removed the plastic...
2. There's some fiberglass work on the hull near the port holes (not sure whether that's the right word...sry if I got that wrong). That's the area that probably gets treaded and sat on the most. There's cracks on both sides of each hull, that initially look like just cracks in the gel coat but now are clearly going all the way through. They are close to the bend which makes me think that simply layering on fiberglass mats may not do the trick since the top is a lot weaker than the side and takes most of the heat from trading. So probably the best thing to do is to try work in some kind of support from the inside of the hull since it's possible to reach to most of the area using the arm.
Anyone have some pointers where to look up for guidance that would be useful.
I'd like to fix the hull first b/c if that doesn't get fixed right the boat may have a more limited life time...
I will post some pics soon but still need to figure out how that works here...
here's a 5 minute clip of from that last run in Mission Bay, Tuesday Jan. 14 this week. The weather was awesome, winds were a bit of a mixed bag, ranging from 0 - 12 knots. There were times nothing was happening and then times where it picked up pretty hard. At one point we almost flipped, I think it's in the middle of the video, maybe not so noticeable but from where I was sitting on the port side, it looked like the mast was coming right down to bury me within a split second....anyway we righted just in time, after my buddy Shawn had uncleated the main...
How is your camera mounted? Always looking for new ideas.
Pete
How is your camera mounted?
I like it. You can tell the rudder input by the camera angle.
Edited by redtwin on Jan 17, 2014 - 10:13 PM.
is this boat too much for a non-cat sailor?
A bit much for a entry level boat. We have three of them at our club and have done some rescues when they go over with new sailors. We had more problems with these with rigging problems of old rigging failing and folks getting into trouble that way. The illusion of the boat being in very good condition because it is fiberglass comes into play. The rigging is often way past do for replacement. They need to be able to right the boat every time is something to be considered before hoisting the sails and gliding away. My intro to sailing was a mono hull with my father after one day on the boat we took it out solo. We ended up getting towed back,, lol After that I learned a very valueable lesson,, Only sail catamarans without my Dad,
it's good to be cautious but that way I might end up spending a few years before I eventually got to a catamaran this size...it's hard to be wise and balance all one's needs at the same time.....but then what are "needs"...and sometimes you just gotta wing it...lol
I love my Prindle 19 but am thinking about getting a second cat that may be easier to single hand and raise the mast on. When I initially looked into purchasing my first P19 cat someone suggested going smaller so like a H16 or P16 that still had a jib for maneuverability. I tossed that idea out from the getgo b/c I wanted the ability to sail the ocean. Budget for second boat ~$1,500 and hopefully mast and boat will fit in the driveway. There's a P16 that looks like fun:
http://sandiego.craigslist.org/nsd/boa/4702324195.html
Can a Hobie 14 accomodate two sailors?
Any other thoughts or suggestions?
You would not be happy with a H-14. P-16 is the way to go and that red one looks good, but red hulls oxidize quickly unless garaged. I have a white hulled one with brand new tramp & nice sails. Pete pbegle@charter.net
I picked up a P16 with that same 2-tone color, badly oxidized, used 800 grit water-paper to remove oxidization which brought the color back, sealed it with Poliglow, no more oxidization.
http://www.poliglow.net/?gclid=CLXLhK6xv8ECFQqTaQodor8AhQ
yes, I figure the H14 is too small and sailing without a jib probably is not much fun, so H16 or P16 seems the way to go.
How long is the mast on a P16?
Is the mast a lot easier to raise than that of a P18 or P19, possinle even single handed? I definitely need two guys for raising the mast on my P19.
Edited by marekli on Oct 22, 2014 - 07:26 AM.
Mast on P-16 is 26' and no spreaders; very easy one person raising. And righting from capsize is one person depending on wind condition & your weight. The boat is 40 #'s lighter than a H-16 & Harkens are standard. Deck hatches allow internal storage. Boom is loose footed so you're carrying a much lighter bagged mainsail. I don't consider The P-16 as a starter boat, but as a starter & a finisher because it's a great single hander, yet carries two very well. Pete
thanks for the info Pete. I already own a P19 that I am happy with, just raising mast single handed does not work and since I don't have mast up storage close to me or affordable I am thinking about getting a second smaller boat that I can do the set up and sail on my own. At 26' the P16's is still a tall mast but should easy to store off the trailer without the spreaders since it would probably be too long for my driveway.
I looked at the P16 at MBYC a few days ago, it's a nice boat - not as in good shape as on the pics but with updated rigging it should sail a few seasons...no problems with hull and the sails looked ok.
Having a mast up storage spot for my P19 during the warm season may be a good other option. Oceanside and Dana Point Harbors both have a marina with dry storage close to ramps or hoist and I could practice sailing on the ocean something I really did not get much of a chance to to do the first year with the P19. Wonder what other folks usually pay for cat mast up storage, what are rates in SD area like?
I'm paying $60 per month in Santa Cruz for on trailer storage during the winter and on beach storage May-Oct. I was quoted $90 per month in Redwood City for fenced in dry storage near the boat ramp. Which seems high to me because Redwood City has a 2.5 mile channel to traverse before you get to the south end of the SF Bay. It really isn't a prime location in terms of water, but it is in the heart of Silicon Valley.
Edited by ramstadt on Oct 31, 2014 - 08:40 AM.