1182 ......'Twice Shy'

Now its home and I've walked around it 20 odd times, its time to see just how bad things really are.....

20mins later and one hull has come up like new !!! <img src="<>/laugh.gif" alt="laugh" title="laugh" height="15" width="15" />

this was just a simple case of a light cut & polish, all up the hulls took about an hour an a bit to have gleaming in the late afternoon sun

things are looking up
<img src="<>/blush.gif" alt="blush" title="blush" height="15" width="15" />

with the hulls basically gleaming in green <img src="<>/sick.gif" alt="sick" title="sick" height="15" width="15" />
it was time to have a look at the mast, first job was to hose off all the bird shyte, then a gentle wipe-down with a scouring pad, then came the 800grit wet&dry paper followed by the alloy polish, all up ~2.5hours spent on cleaning up the mast
<img src="<>/smirk.gif" alt="smirk" title="smirk" height="15" width="15" />

the boom is still work in progress

but its calf-shyte yellowish paint is only the top layer, a cool white lays under that followed by the dark green which matches the strip down the sides of the hull, then comes the alloy...
I hit the boom with 80grit paper on the belt sander and an hour later we had bare alloy again, I then hand blocked it back with 120grit then 180grit and finally with some 320 wet&dry paper, polishing is yet to come but so far its lookin good
(finished pic to come) <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

Only other work required on the boom is to replace the shocky cord which has perished in a couple of spots but otherwise its done

<img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

so while I'm sanding/polishing bits I notice a tad bit of movement in the hulls, a quick investigation soon finds the culprit, well actually lack there of <img src="<>/eek.gif" alt="eek" title="eek" height="15" width="15" />

spot what's missing ????

<img src="<>/smirk.gif" alt="smirk" title="smirk" height="15" width="15" />

So 2 hours later and several scratches from jagged fibreglass shards, I'd replaced all the alloy blocks with 40mm wide X10mm thick and 60mmlong blocks of high-tensile alloy

these are what's left
NB: pic is as they were removed from the hulls as if you were at the stern .... so the top left is the front left and the bottom right is the rear right block.....
The 'larger' block 3rd in the top row is the one for the missing altogether mounting point in the pic in the above post

couple of close-ups....

well that sucked.... but as per usual there's always an explanation ------> SILICONE <img src="<>/mad.gif" alt="mad" title="mad" height="15" width="15" />
Some of you are probably well aware of the properties of silicone, it has ACID in it and the acid attacks alloy like crazy, someone in their infinite wisdom has used a non-neutral cure silicone and hence we have the ugly corrosion.
Don't belive me ????? duck down to the local panel-beaters and ask for a quote for a leaking windscreen, after you have that rough estimate tell them you siliconed it up a year ago, the quote WILL double instantly, silicone is BAD news if you don't use the right one for the specific application.....

I hear crickets......
everyone must have gone to the shed to see what type of silicone they used to seal that stainless fitting to the alloy mast...
I hope your not too late, relax, the stainless fitting will be fine, the rest tho.....
<img src="<>/shocked.gif" alt="shocked" title="shocked" height="15" width="15" />

one more...

you can actually see the silicone in this pic and you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see where the corrosion has come from...

<img src="<>/tired.gif" alt="tired" title="tired" height="15" width="15" />

What about KARP you ask......
Well I'm still working away on the hull finish, but being so damn fussy meant I wasn't about to get on the water before January or Febuary at best, so as its turned out I should have 1182 ready in a week or so all going to plan on what I've found thus far, and yes there's still one or two more uglies to fix but more on those as I get to them.

1182 also offers me a cheap platform to try things out, the TredGrip I spoke about in the

non-skid: gunwale

thread
http://www.catsailor.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=265005#Post265005
will be one of the first things I trial, if it works to the level I want then it will make KARP's gunwales, I have a few other things to tryout so with this boat I get the chance to play without burning the

good boat

so to speak

As to 1182's future ???
A new name was the first thing, Mistral is GONE so please welcome

TWICE SHY

to the fold <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />
mozzie related and combined with the old saying....
Once bitten TWICE SHY and then theres the 2nd mozzie thing.

The name just fitted so well <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

Its future.....
[yoda voice on]
darkness I see but with a light afar
[yoda voice off]

For now Twice Shy will be patched up and put on the water ASAP, once I have KARP finished then I'll most likely re-deck Twice Shy and take it from there.
There's always someone that wants a mozzie and whether its my sons or she finds a new home or becomes the first mozzie to foil.... couldn't resist that one <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />
At this stage she's moved away from the rubbish heap and I'm sure both I and my kids will enjoy her to the max, and undoutably someone one day will want her for their own aswell

watch this space..... more to come
<img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

Kingy

edit:
23 views already...... <img src="<>/shocked.gif" alt="shocked" title="shocked" height="15" width="15" />
get to bed ya silly buggers
<img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

Just a hint, when getting paint off alloy, use a

strip and clean

mop that goes on a makita polisher and takes it back to bare alloy with about 80 grit keyed on the alloy

<img src="<>/cry.gif" alt="cry" title="cry" height="15" width="15" /> now you tell me <img src="<>/crazy.gif" alt="crazy" title="crazy" height="15" width="15" />

oh well, it gleams good enough for now....

just the shock-cord to fit now.....
<img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

Thinking caps on gents.....

why ????

&

How do I get around this ???

and yes that's the shed floor you can see through the near 2inch gap

<img src="<>/confused.gif" alt="confused" title="confused" height="15" width="15" />

even the

fit

at the bottom is as bad as the deck fit with an almost 2inch gap, and yeah that's the shed roof
<img src="<>/shocked.gif" alt="shocked" title="shocked" height="15" width="15" />

Jurassic Karp's boards (colored grey) against Twice Shy's boards (timber) which are 200mm (~8inches) longer .....
and yet the widths are within a millimetre of each other in the board-case area
<img src="<>/confused.gif" alt="confused" title="confused" height="15" width="15" />

I'm thinking of cutting off ~150mm (6inches) off of Twice Shy's boards....

thoughts ???

<img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

cut them down, a lot of the old boards are very long.
front of plate case glue in a bit of timber and shape to fit leading edge of board. you want the boards back as far as you can get them.

Agreed on the fix you've described, already have the cedar cut and ready to shape...... but why so much excess in the case slots ?????

<img src="<>/confused.gif" alt="confused" title="confused" height="15" width="15" />

I found a soft spot in the bottom of one hull when I was cleaning / polishing, the paint , it was soft enough to crack the actual paint with very light pressure....

so after I attacked the trailer and started a few changes & repairs, we slipped Twice Shy over and had a serious dig in the region, one soft spot.... turns out I have a few more
<img src="<>/frown.gif" alt="frown" title="frown" height="15" width="15" />

better check the other hull..... and much the same story there too <img src="<>/mad.gif" alt="mad" title="mad" height="15" width="15" />

mutter mutter mutter

The soft spots in each hull line up with each other rather well don't they, obviously water and sitting on the trailer for a few months will do this

so tomorrow's job after I do a tad more with the trailer is to repair these little buggars, I'll square up the holes a bit better and scarf the ends/sides, cut a piece of fresh ply and cut/scarf it to fit and resin it in, I'll add some filler as required and hopefully a lick of primer during the week.

the ugly trailer.....
yeah it needs a tidy up and a couple of minor repairs and mods
the thing I cant get over is just how well this thing tows, bloody great trailer to tow that's for sure !!!

me thinks these have had their day...... well and truly !!!

and with the carpet off..... someone has done some very TLC work here....

high time they were replaced....
<img src="<>/cool.gif" alt="cool" title="cool" height="15" width="15" />

the new ones.....

In the above pic (first in the last post) you can see I'd already done the front ones.

finished the 2 rear ones last night (sorry about the pic's darkness but it was a late night
<img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

sewer pipe cut/heated and moulded to the hull shape....
Riveted onto a steel rhs base and with 3mm plate added as support wings.
The front ones are solidly mounted whilst the rears 'hinge' down ~25degrees.

just got to glue on the carpet now.....

I'll add a front rack to pickup the front beam and a hinging rear rack to hold the rear beam.....
these slippers will only be used for loading and unloading the boat.

while resin is going off, I decided the orange/red/blue thingy at the bow had to go..... probably very cool back in the day but now ???
definately not my cuppa rum <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

80grit took care of it and I was able to stay out of the base primer underneath it all largely

NB:
the blue was the hardest to remove, tough stuff that readily clogged the lower grit papers so that's why I started with the 80grit, the orange was also tough but once I touched the primer it cut away very easily, the red was childs play to sand off.... half a dozen swipes and it fell away easily.
The dark green stripe is coming off quite easily aswell, as did the old name
<img src="<>/laugh.gif" alt="laugh" title="laugh" height="15" width="15" />

luckily the green carried through under the 'splash of colors' so once I had them off I went straight down to 180grit paper and took off the primer

once the primer was gone and the green fully revealed I changed down to 320grit paper.
although it isn't perfect color-wise the finish is ultra smooth and ready for my touch of bling
<img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

The main reason I did this was ....
1/
had a couple of large chips in the leading edges that needed filling

2/
the glass was actually worn right through at the front where its been dragged up on the sand over the years, again in need of filling

3/
it will tie in with what I'm doing for the short-term

repairs

to the main and foredeck (the rear decks will be replaced as they are completely shagged)

<img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

now I know I said earlier that I was going to cut / scarf in some new bits ply...... but I decided against that for a couple of reasons.
1/
time restraints: after I'd cut the first bit I figured this was going to take ages and I wanted a simple solid quick fix, simply because I won't know what's going in there until I tear the decks off in the off season.... the rot may be far worse than I know about at the moment

2/
strength issue: scarfing in is the traditional method BUT it lacks some strength, there was also the problem of curving the ply to better suit the hull shape, that meant time being spent of pre-curving the replacement ply aswell as the scarfing.

So I decided to do something an old sailor from way back when taught me at a regatta when my old mozzie was damaged....
a hole from a another mozzie just after the morning race was fixed during lunch and I was back on the water for the afternoon races, although the fresh resin was covered by that trusty old best friend..... gaffa tape
<img src="<>/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin" height="15" width="15" />

cut a ply plate that's just a bit bigger than the hole

bang a staple right in the middle of the plate then remove the staple

thread a fine wire through the 2 holes left by the staple

coat the ply plate in resin and slip into the hole

slip in a short dowel and twitch the wire around it then twitch the dowel so it pulls the plate up against the hull

with the remaining resin add sawdust till its like play-dough in its consistency

trowel the mix into the 'cavity'

let it set..... sand back .... paint as required or if needed

now I've used this old trick many times over, even Jurassic Karp has a few dabs of this in in, specifically where the old stringer slots were.
Its as light as you want it to be, use balsa-wood / cedar / pine etc.
Want it a bit heavier then use harder woods or as I've found plywood itself saved from the band saw works a treat

the big advantage is the strength, all the fine chips of sawdust are not all spread out but mixed up and tightly compacted. It sets super fast and can be sanded easily, I laid it down on Sunday with 7day resin, it was sanded back Monday night, micro filled on Tuesday night and finished tonight.
The process could have been done far quicker had I used a rapid set resin, the whole job would have been done in less than ~4hours

As it stands now, I have structural strength WITH a ply backing plate, the repair can easily be finished off once the decks are removed ..... flap disk on the 4

grinder,

grind" off the ply backing plate, add resin and cloth.... all done
<img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

the dark patches are the sawdust/resin mix

happy with the end result, it smoothed out really well and the microballon filler made it a perfect flush finish

centreboard case's are next on the agenda.....
<img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

Hi Kingy,

I'm thinking that the centreboards that came with Twice Shy were not the original ones. Back in them days the old mozzies had wide boards. <img src="<>/blush.gif" alt="blush" title="blush" height="15" width="15" />

Check where the cases are positioned relative to the rules. I'm guessing that they are well forward and probably vertical relative to the deck.

If thats the case then you could angle the boards back by putting fibreglassed wedged foam blocks into the case and angle them according to the rule limits. It's a quick fix and may improve the old girls handling. <img src="<>/cool.gif" alt="cool" title="cool" height="15" width="15" />

The difference in measurements between 1740 and 1182 are huge, and even with the cedar added to 1182's case its still 60mm further forward than 1740's..... measured from the front beam to the front of the board case.

At D.Y.C. today and I had a look at Al's boat 'Scorpion' and he has a block aswell only his has been placed at the back of the slot pushing the boards as far forwards as possible, his slots are even longer than 1182's.... I ended up with just under ~40mm long cedar packer and Al's would have to be nearer to 55mm of packer.

I'd have to agree that the boards themselves are not designed to run with the setup on the boat although the style and length is from that era as I remember it (recall seeing the dual timber boards and thinking how good they looked when I was moving from jnr-snr sailor), as to what happened with 1182's is anyone's guess....
My first mozzie STINGA #245 had a wide long board and the rudders were narrow and long comparison, much like 1182's are. I remember making a new set of blades that were shorter and wider and could be pushed far further forward under the boat than the old ones to get a better turning boat on the tacks, I also remember cutting off a couple of inches from the width and the length was also cut down on those boards once the rudder mods had been proven to work.

the rudders that came with 1182 are the same in their shape and style in that they are also long and not that wide. but as to what / where / & when the changes were made..... ??????????????????????????????

<img src="<>/confused.gif" alt="confused" title="confused" height="15" width="15" />

40mmx24mm cedar packer in place....
Jurassic Karp hangin around in the background.... <img src="<>/frown.gif" alt="frown" title="frown" height="15" width="15" />

once the boat is flipped back over I'll trim and fill the stub so its flush with the old deck, it will get more work when the decks are replaced in winter.

trimmed.... and filled <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />

the grey tape held the resin filler from running down the case slot and was easy to remove once the resin filler had gone off
<img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

had a bit of resin filler left over......

the mounts had compressed the timber somewhat so it needed to be brought back up flush.
mmmmm getting fussy again.... mental note to self .... STOP IT ! and get the boat on the water !!

After some thought and considerations, I decided that even tho Jurassic Karp's boards are ~200mm shorter, I'd only take off 150mm from Twice Shy's boards.
Main reason for this was Jurassics aren't tapered where-as Twice Shy's are, so I calculated out the actual surface area and ended up with a trim of 150mm being required.

these will be an easy re-shaping of the cut <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />
the tough bit will be the slight slimming of the boards, just a tad tight to slide up n down in the cases....
<img src="<>/frown.gif" alt="frown" title="frown" height="15" width="15" />

27/525

i wouldnt be measuring from the front beam to the cases unless you have measured that the beams are in the same place as all the measurments for the beams and board cases are taken from the bow of the boat.

I've re-checked the measurements against the plans I have that came with Jurassic Karp, the measurements for everything else are within a couple of millimetres of the specs and compare well with Karp, its only the cases that aren't at the specs.

~100mm further forward than they should be even tho they are the wide case slots.
With the ~40mm packer I'm still forward of where it should be by about 60mm.

<img src="<>/confused.gif" alt="confused" title="confused" height="15" width="15" />