I'll be sailing the Viper singlehanded most of the time. I'd be surprised if the jib got use more than three times a year. Anyone have a good solution for removing the jib track, yet making it relatively easy to remount? I was thinking of finding what I've always heard called as a Chicago Bolts, and leaving the tabs that are riveted on the beam in place.
A quick google search calls them barrrel nuts as well.
You're gonna need all the weight you can find, stick boy. Want me to mail you a few pounds?
Now that's funny! <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />
Something else you can do is use synthetic line for your trapeze lines.
There's some stuff you can do to loose a couple of pounds off of the boat.
Synthetic trap wires.
Lighter hotstick. The Stick that comes with the boat is pretty lightweight, but if you want extendable, those can sometimes be kind of heavy. I got a Marstrom hoststick and it feels as light as the long one that comes stock with the boat. It's EXPENSIVE however. <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />
Some 14mm micro blocks for the downhaul. Use Harken, they are supposed to be better of the two in that size. I think that's the size anyway.
Where you can think of something better and lighter, do it. <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" /> It's all class legal in the F16 class. <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />
Mike
You didn't know thats actually me in my avatar?
I'm just looking for ideas on the two up parts. The stuff that I'd be carrying around for no reason.
I'm on the traplines. I fricken hate wire. 3 days sailing and a couple are already mangled and don't coil nicely. Plus I leave them on the mast when I trailer, a couple of ball ties and a bungee and I don't have to worry about them beating the crap outta the mast.
Mike are you doing the clinic in April?
Karl-if you are doing the clinic, why not make the vacation a little longer and swing by Spring Fever on your way south??
That goes for the MD guys too... Hope to see a fleet of 16's in Hartwell.
We are going straight south after wards for the clinic also.
Go synthitic on traps; shrouds and forestay; taper Mainsheet, spi sheets, spi halyard, downhaul.
get rid of jib sheets and halyards etc
will not save loads; but can shed a few KG.
The Maryland guys have it down to a science. Some of them have even deleted the back-to-back block on the spin halyard.
yeah, I'm doing the clinic. <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />
I haven't quite decided on if I'm going to do Spring Fever and then head to FL after wards. I got to talk to my stack mate to see what his plans are.
Mike
Hopefully you all realize that in the US ... your portsmouth rating is pegged to the two up F16.
To be fair to your competitors in Portsmouth Racing, you should adjust your rating for the lighter boat by about 2 %
The ISAF standard shows the following.
SCHRS rates the F16 1.008
the cat rigged F16 is faster at .982
For reference, the F18 is 1.005
ie just sec's per hour faster then the two up F16.
The two up F16 DPN was set by consensus (not data) at 63.0 while the F18 rating is faster at 62.4
Go fuckup somebody else's thread Mark.
Joanna, I would but fortunately work is balls out right now. I'm still not fully caught up from the ten days I disappeared for Tradewinds. Hopefully it all peters out around June and I can kick back for the summer. <img src="<>/whistle.gif" alt="whistle" title="whistle" height="15" width="15" />
We can discuss it as soon as you become a F16 Class member.
I think the F18s are calling you, why don't you go see what they want.
Mark,
I think the F16 class already made a great nod to the larger racing scene by having leveled THE MUCH MORE MUCH SLOWLY USPN F16 1-up rating to the FASTER USPN 2-up rating.
Now you are asking for even more ?
Besides SCHRS (ISAF) is WAAAAAAY off in rating singlehanders; they always have been. Not a good point of reference therefor
Wouter
Wouter... a great nod to the larger racing scene is not an adequate basis for rating the boat. ANY class gets consulted and asked for data but they are not determining the rating or do they necessarily agree with the published rating in a PN system. The history of the F16 rating process ... was unfortunate.
Portsmouth was unable to fairly rate the two boats (2up or one up) (There were lots of reasons then and the situation is more difficult in 2010). The need for a PHRF like adjustment nod was a solution to the systemic problem of the PN system.
The alternative measurement rating system that would most likely be adopted in the USA would be ISAF's SCHRS which indicates a real difference in performance. How accurate the SCHRS rating system is for single handers is an entirely different issue for the general discussion forum. The international multihull council would be the appropriate organization to drive a consensus between the measurement rating systems ... or simply to pick one that they determine is fair.
I am suggesting that the class be proactive and address the mismatch for the US Portmsouth system for the upcoming 2010 season. (Mind you this is a thread about how much junk you can dump to lighten the boat but the impact on your PN rating was overlooked.)
Mark. Why are you picking on us? If you must talk about inappropriate numbers, why not go to the main board?
We've at least tried to come up with an accurate number. There are boats who refuse to do that.
Go to the main board with this. Please!
Pete. Mark is going around to different classes to see if anyone will talk to him. Nobody else does, we shouldn't either. Ed
Mark, I think your time would be better spent trying to persuade Mr Master Uni Rig Sailor to play fair and get his 'F'17 measured and a fair PHRF assigned to it and the other so called 'F'17s.................
A bonus might be that people might think a little better of you
Agreed.
Sorry Mark,
I really don't see any reason to do more then we have already done. The F16 class succeeded in making both its USPN ratings faster (despite the US racing data !) and we coped with significant heat for doing just that.
63 as a rating for both setups is quite right for the F16 boats in my opinion. With Scooby I agree that some other classes are much better candidates for a rating modification then us at this time.
I often enjoyed discussing this things with you, but I really don't agree with you on this one.
Again I'm sorry,
Wouter
A bonus might be that people might think a little better of you
Agreed; I've been waiting nearly 2 years for the F17 data....
Very poor form on the aprt of Nacra / F17 owners NOT to get the data sorted out; we (SCHRS management group) keep the slot open on the website; all is ready on our part to update the site with the correct rating; we are just (still) waiting for measurement certs.....
Nowt we can do until someone sorts out getting the boat measured. I've no idea why this has not been done; maybe Nacra are shelving the F17 and so do not see the need to get it measured? Maybe they cannot build it consistantly to any of the 11 different all up weight's I've been told, maybe that just do not see the rest of the world as a market for it - which I find odd as having owned a Inter 17 it's a good boat.
Mucho oddness.....
I wish the F16 and F17 boys and girls could get along. The boats are nearly identical in performance. So geting pissd of about handicap ratings doesnt make a lot of sense to me. You just need to race each other off scatch and beat each other over the line.
For the record ive seen the numbers for the F17 sloop and its 104 texel rating but im sure i ve mentioned this before. You would have to delete a **** load of wieght from the F17 to get it to weigh near any of the production F16s.
F17 is a great boat none the less. They should definitely be starting with and included in the results with the F16s IMO. Maybe we can learn something from the Master Uni rig sailor as well. It would be fun to have a crack at him any way.
For the record ive seen the numbers for the F17 sloop and its 104 texel rating but im sure i ve mentioned this before. You would have to delete a **** load of wieght from the F17 to get it to weigh near any of the production F16s.
F17 is a great boat none the less. They should definitely be starting with and included in the results with the F16s IMO. Maybe we can learn something from the Master Uni rig sailor as well. It would be fun to have a crack at him any way.
Could you please send the certs to me; I'm STILL waiting for them to calc an SCHRS rating.
Sorry Simon I don't have a photographic memory. You must know some of the numbers. Get Wouter to do some extrapolation for you.
Back to the original question. The skiff boys all use these on their cunningham (and vang).
go to Carbon where easy. Boom, spinnaker pole, tiller cross bar.
rivnuts
to make adding amd removing jib gear easy.
Makes sense scarecrow. When I'm rich a carbon mast is going on too.
Wow, the nutsert's themselves aren't that bad, but the kit to get the tool is crazy expensive! I haven't found just the tool yet, but the kits from Fastenal are $145-$244. I'm sure they come with more fasteners than I need though.
A person probably wants to make sure those threads are well lubed, and removed periodically to prevent siezing. I gotta imagine those are a bugger to remove once corroded.
Gotta love McMaster-Carr. $30 for the tool.
(edit)- I'd assume stainless would be the best route to go, but what about aluminum? Too easy to strip out?
(edit#2)- I was thinking about getting some carbon fibre tube for the boom and tiller crossbar, but really that was just because its so damn sexy.
yes go stainless, but if looking at a
cheap tool
do a test pull before your pay. The big St. steel rivnuts are really hard to press.
I was looking at the model that requires a box end wrench, and an allen key.
http:/
or search for
riv nut installation tool
No good; We need measurement confirmation of numbers. The Measurement certificate that was presented at Carnac 2008 will do; I was told I would be sent it. It never came; I still wonder why.
http:/
I've never used one of them. I've always used the big double handle jobs.
or search for
riv nut installation tool