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THOE
 THOE
(@THOE)
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[#26778]

Last year was my first season on a spinnaker boat and I looked back at all my capsizes and as expected, the majority were downwind rounding the mark in higher winds. I’ve heard a few suggestions on how to keep the tiller stable during a chute takedown, but wanted to see if there were other tips out there from uni sailors.

This is a part of my 6 point plan to emerge from the bottom of the fleet.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 7:59 am
pepin
(@noyau)
Posts: 966
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My technique to take down the chute is to kneel on the back of the trampoline, facing forward, with one leg slightly extended to put a foot on the tiller bar. The foot does the steering while I use my two hands to pull the spi in the bag.

I also throw the tiller extension over the back of the boat on the downwind leg, so it's not in the way when I snuff the spi, and this also helps keeping the rudders stable.

But looking back at last season my most spectacular capsize was at the UK nationals in Mumbles where I bought it snuffing the spi right as a wave lifted the back of the boat around sending me into an uncontrolled surf session which ended rather badly <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" /> So it's not like it's a foolproof solution either...


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 8:46 am
(@mikeborden)
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Were you stuffing?

Do you have one foot on the tiller to steer boat?

All my capsized have been going downwind also, but when jibing. Not going around the bottom mark, I'm a little consevative though.

Are you still sheeted in hard? When you round the mark?


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 8:50 am
pgp
 pgp
(@pgp48)
Posts: 4470
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Coaching clinic, particularly one with a focus on spinnakers. Best money you'll ever spend.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 9:01 am
THOE
 THOE
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I only capsized once on a jibe last year. Most were take downs just before the mark where I didn't get the chute down fast enough and the boat began to round up.

Some were due to angle of attack on the mark. We sail gates a lot and with an extreme angle to the gate, I wouldn't get as downwind as needed which hindered take downs as well.

One of the suggestions I picked up at GC was to pin the tiller between thigh and calf as I kneel to take down the spin.

This seems better than the foot method just because I want to be careful not to break the crossbar. However, the idea of tossing the tiller out the back is appealing.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 9:02 am
THOE
 THOE
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Yeah, I hear ya on the clinics. I'm 0 for 3 on the clinics for this season. One thing or another has come up.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 9:04 am
pgp
 pgp
(@pgp48)
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Gotta do it.

For some the sport is intuitive and they can get by without training (though I imagine the very top train the most), for us tail-enders, training is the only way.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 9:16 am
THOE
 THOE
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I prefer to think of myself as a

F16 fleet supporter

or

regatta boat count booster

<img src="<>/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin" height="15" width="15" />


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 9:35 am
pdwarren
(@pdwarren)
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Like Mike, I find the jibes more of a problem. Make sure you let out the traveller and the main before dropping. This will remove the tendency of the boat to round up as the kite comes down. I usually kneel down and put the tiller extension under my foot to hold it straight. I can steer a little like this, but generally I try to get the kite down fast enough that I don't have to steer.

In lighter winds, leave a bit more main/traveller tension on and the boat will start to round itself up.

Paul


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 10:15 am
THOE
 THOE
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Thanks Paul,

How far do you let out the traveller/main?

Any concerns in higher winds about putting too much pressure on the spin with the main eased?


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 10:18 am
(@mikeborden)
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Originally Posted by TEH
Thanks Paul,

How far do you let out the traveller/main?

Any concerns in higher winds about putting too much pressure on the spin with the main eased?

Just as long as you don't ease 10 feet of it you can let out enough to not round up and not hurt your mast.

I also let out the traveler, but it depends on the wind of how much I let out. I'm not good yet, so in higher winds, I let out on the traveler almost as much as when I'm setting the spin...which means all the way down. Again, I'm probably being to conservative in doing this, so that means you'll be a little slow.

I think the biggest trick is to find the groove where you can let out on both enough and the boat won't round up and as you do turn up into the wind to go, that you aren't sheeted in too much, that's where you'll usually loose it and capsize. At least from what I have seen....

I do steer with my foot...here's how I do it....

One knee on the tramp, the other knee with the foot on the tramp. Put the tiller on the top of the boat, put your foot that is with the knee in the tramp on top of the tiller. Your steering isn't precise, but it's better than not having any steering at all. And, you have enough steering so you can control where you want the boat to go. This works snuffing and setting....

Is that clear as mud? <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

One thing that I have been told time and time again, always have the tiller in one hand and the sheet in the other or at least the two of them together in one hand. Us singlehanders, that's kind of hard to do. So, the next best thing to do is sticking the tiller under butt or something while you are cleaning up the tramp for example.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 11:34 am
(@mikeborden)
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BTW, those are some tricks I learned from doing Clinics...

So I think you owe me 150! <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 11:35 am
pdwarren
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Not once the spin sheets are eased.

In strong winds, I ease both quite a lot - traveller most of the way down, and a good few armfuls of main.

Paul


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 11:42 am
Gilo
 Gilo
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No problem easing the main. As long as you do it after have the pressure our of the spinnaker. (check the picture)
A seperate tack is handy too. It takes a little longer, but you have time to steer in between the drop.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 11:50 am
THOE
 THOE
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Thanks. I think easing is the key because I had been doing my own version of the tiller pin and still having issues.

What's the sequence? I'm using a single line with a spin lock on the front beam.


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 11:56 am
(@mikeborden)
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Here's what I do...

Just before I think it's time for me to start snuffing, I fall off just a bit, ease the traveler and the main, set the tiller on the boat(over the side), do the kneeling thing that I was talking about, put you foot on the tiller, pop the cleat, and then start snuffing. By the time you get to the mark, you should be almost done snuffing. If that's the case, you can use your foot on the tiller to start rounding up. Again, thats only doable if you have enough sheet and traveler out, cause if you have it sheeted too much and you start rounding, OVER you go.

It sounds complicated, but it's doable. You have to be creative on the third hand. <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 12:13 pm
(@wmkhath)
Posts: 590
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Originally Posted by mikeborden
Here's what I do...

Just before I think it's time for me to start snuffing, I fall off just a bit, ease the traveler and the main, set the tiller on the boat(over the side), do the kneeling thing that I was talking about, put you foot on the tiller, pop the cleat, and then start snuffing. By the time you get to the mark, you should be almost done snuffing. If that's the case, you can use your foot on the tiller to start rounding up. Again, thats only doable if you have enough sheet and traveler out, cause if you have it sheeted too much and you start rounding, OVER you go.

It sounds complicated, but it's doable. You have to be creative on the third hand. <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />

You've got it all figured out. LOL, No wonder the SCHRS rating is lower for the Uni <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 3:13 pm
(@mikeborden)
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Your killing me! <img src="<>/smile.gif" alt="smile" title="smile" height="15" width="15" />


 
Posted : May 6, 2010 3:16 pm
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