Regatta Date Conflicts

That's a great idea bill! I don't know that it needs to be so much of an 'approved' or 'disapproved' regatta system but simply notifying other regatta organizers of a potential conflict and putting them in touch with each other would be a great service.

That is exactly what we want to do with NAMSA. And now is the time to submit regatta schedules. Just send them me at rick@catsailor.com

For years I have had the horrible duty of trying to get folks to tell us what their schedules are.., and it has been like pulling teeth. And I believe that those who send us the event dates and get them published have better turn outs.
Once I get them, I post them on our Events Page and publish them in our magazine (for those who don't know we do publish a pretty darned informative hard copy magazine monthly 8 issues per year Click Here to Subscribe) )

While NAMSA does not have any set rules on regatta dates, it would be just common sense to notify folks that there is an obvious conflict that will hurt both parties.

Rick

Hi Rick,
The "RULES" I am talking about are the criteria or logic steps that NAMSA would use to decide in favor of one party over a contested date. These need to be known, published up front, so that when NAMSA does make a contested regatta date decision, the party that was not allowed to use the date in question understands why they were disallowed. This eliminates the posibility of favoritism. We don't want anybody to feel that they were treated unfairly.
Bill

Billrob,

There are a limited number of sailing weekends in a year to be used by hundreds of different fleets.
We have cold weather, Dog Days, Hurricane season, etc.
Many Fleets have to coordinate with a Yacht Club or other organization and their needs.
Trying to coordinate all regatta dates at a national level is impossible and impractical.

I have been involved with Hobie Division 9 for ten years.
There are 13 Hobie fleets , of which nine held regattas this year.
They hold an annual meeting where they make the schedule for the next year.
Even a group this small ends up fighting over dates.

Agree with Sam. We just had our Div. 4, Fleet 95 meeting tonight, and set our requested dates. At the Div. 4 AGM, next week, the dates will be resolved for all the events. This is not only for our Div. regattas,National,and World Regattas, but other programs, such as "Fast and Fun", Hobie 101/102 introduction classes, and Regattas for the large boats owned and crewed on by many of our multihull sailors.

Caleb Tarleton, Seattle

So is the conclusion,"it can't be made to work perfect therefore forget it, don't try"? This sounds like where we are now. Sailors are always going to go the the races they want to. If there are more than one race on the same weekend in a local area, at least why not point it out? Maybe next year the clubs involved would work it out on their own or combine races. Maybe the best thing NAMSA can do is publish all regatta dates. Any conflicts will be obvious; the sailors will make their choices and attendance will work things out in time.
Bill

First of all, it is not often that we have a World Championship in the United States, and when we do have one, I think everyone who has one of those boats (or can charter one) should be there. Nobody should have to think twice about whether they want to go to Spring Fever or to a Worlds. To me it is a no-brainer. Whether you sail a Tiger as a one-design or as an F18, you will get a major education by going to a World Championship. If we had a Tiger (and if we were a little younger), we would have already reserved a spot on that truck to take it to California. A Worlds is worth spending your whole regatta budget for the year. A regatta like Spring Fever is a lot of fun, but it is probably not going to do much to improve your racing skills, because you are sailing against the same people you ALWAYS sail against.

I'll bet even Nigel would like to be at that Tiger Worlds.

Another reason is that when we hold a World Championship here, we should show our support and enthusiasm by getting every live Tiger there. If people are coming from Europe and all over the world, certainly the U.S. boats and sailors can get there.

Second of all: Maybe some agency within US Sailing (the Multihull Council in the case of the beach cats) could have a rule like what ISAF has. ISAF requires that World Championships or other ISAF events submit their dates to ISAF by August 1st of the year preceding the event. (Unfortunately, they do not appear on the ISAF calendar until the actual year of the event.)

In the case of the United States, if major one-design championships (Nationals, North Americans, Midwinters, etc.) and also major multiple-class regattas like Madcatter and Spring Fever and Tradewinds, plus World and International events, could all be on a calendar by, for instance, August 1 of 2004, (and if those dates could be published during August), then all the other regattas could take that into consideration when planning their more local events for 2005. Most of the local and regional schedules are planned during the fall of the preceding year, so this would give them ample advance notice.

By announcing the major-event schedule in August, this gives the major-event organizers time to see whether there are any conflicts in scheduling of the big events so that adjustments can be made if necessary, before all the other schedules are established.

But I think scheduling conflicts are something that should be worked out by the affected event organizers and not mediated by some third party.

There are a small number of "major" beach-cat events, and most of those are already locked in on traditional dates, so it should be fairly easy to have a calendar of the following year's major events published in August of the preceding year.

When a specific class is planning to hold a World Championship in the United States, the organizers should try to plan their event dates so there is not a conflict with another of the "usual," prescheduled big events in the United States.

If the Tiger World Championship has been in the planning stages for three years, they should have been aware that there might be a scheduling conflict with Spring Fever, which attracts a lot of Tigers. HOWEVER, it is too late now to change the date for the Worlds, so it is up to Spring Fever, if they think it would be in their best interests to change their date.

Bill,
We have been publishing all the dates around the country ever since we started the magazine.., about 8 years ago.
And the magazine is the ONLY place that lists all the events for all the mulithulls.., including the big tris and cats.., as foreign events, seminars, distance races, etc.

Of course, as I said in an earlier post, it sure would nice if we could get all the fleets, divisions, clubs, et al to send us those events, dates and contacts, but we usually have to dig around and find them on our own. There are several organizations that are really good about sending us their information.., and it shows in their event attendance.

Rick

Mary,
I disagree with your position here.
"First of all, it is not often that we have a World Championship in the United States, and when we do have one, I think everyone who has one of those boats (or can charter one) should be there."
There should be qualifications/requirements met to attend a World Championship event. To "just be a boat owner" allows sailors who don't know the sailing rules or who do not have very sharp skills to sail in a major event. These sailors frequently ruin a start or a heat for a serious contender because they do not know the basic racing rules. Sailors who don't know how to sail well and do not know the racing rules should not be on the race course at a World Championship event. Sailors should have to "qualify" to enter a National Championship or higher skill level event. If this isn't the case, then the event itself is compromised and some serious contender might have their chances for a top position ruined by some dumb bunny who doesn't know the rules and caused an accident they didn't even know they were causing. This is why in most classes there are "qualifications, requirements to meet" for a competitor to be allowed to sail in a National Championship or higher event.
All we have to do is look at how older, more experienced, classes hold World Championship events. Look at how the Olympic classes do it. They have been through the school of hard knocks and we can learn from them.
Bill

I agree with Bill Roberts about the desirability of qualification for National and World events: Yup- I've been there and done it that way. I busted my butt to qualify for Nationals and World Championships: granted- that was Hobies in the 70s and early 80s, but many, many sailors worked very hard to learn and improve. Now that boat dealers, makers and sellers tend to run events, if any, where is the old emphasis on knowledge, skill and ability? It turns the ignition key on an $12,000 Jetski.

Signed, the Other Old Curmudgeon.

I seriously doubt someone that doesn't know the basic rules would spend the money to show up at a world event. Even so, the intimidation level on the race course, especially at starts, keeps them from getting into trouble.

For 15 years, the Hobie classes have allowed anybody willing to pay the entry fee to show up and race at a North American event. I've personally participated in 20 of them in four different classes. Not once can I remember being interefered with by "some dumb bunny who doesn't know the rules and caused an accident they didn't even know they were causing." On the other hand, I can remember several situations where people who knew the rules all too well, interefered with starts, mark roundings - you name it.

The two world events that I've participated in both required pre-qualification - but only because the manufacturer was supplying the boats and for no other reason. I could not find a single NOR for an Olympic Class World Championship - so I don't know if your statement is true or not. I suspect it isn't, at least for some of the classes, since the results for their worlds are pretty stacked with "local" sailors.

The bottom line is we need to encourage class sailing throughout the US, not discourage it by installing artificial hurdles for attendance. The only time restrictions need to be set for entry is when the projected attendance exceeds the ability of the venue to accomodate it (bad choice of venue) or when the mfg supplies boats (like Hobie did prior to 15 years ago and will be doing for the 16 NA's in the next three years).

Bill,
That is an asinine response and you obviously didn't read my or Calebs comments very closely.
We both stated that Hobie Divisions coordinate their regatta dates to resolve conflicts.
In the Hobie Division 9 area, which stretches from Atlanta to Virginia Beach,
they even try to schedule around the few non-Hobie Fleet events.

What have YOU ever done?

Hi Sam,
It is good to hear that within the Hobie world of sailing, the leadership strives to avoid regatta conflicts. If one sails only within the Hobie races, no problems. The only possible conflict I can see happening here is a distance race and a Hobie race falling on the same date. Many of us do not subcribe to the Hobie class news letter/magazine and therefore we do not know the Hobie regatta schedule except for what Rick White, NAMSA, publishes. If all regatta sponsors did that, any conflicts would be known well ahead of time. It is also good advertising for the race.
I'm not sure of the subject of your last comment. In the 1970s I served as race committee chairman and or protest committee chairman for many Hobie class regattas, mostly H14s and 16s. The Florida Gold Coast Championship Race sailed in West Palm Beach was an important Hobie class race in the 70s.
Bill