Secondly, this is the first class I have heard off that are arguing to have their rating increased (reflect the boat is faster). If you believe it is a gift rating compared to an A or F18, you are a fool to ague agaist this advantage. No other class will.
It only sounds like little brother syndrome and nothing else. The F16 class is better than that.
TA; totally agree...... Fleets do not need the other boats.
I think it's only one person who is suffering from Little brother syndrome....
Just the same as light F18 teams might find a better fit on an F16, heavy F16 teams might find a better fit on the F18. No need to bash one fleet or the other.
+1
I agree completely..
-1
My wife is only allowing me decaff. She says the real stuff makes me cranky and hard to get along with! <img src="<>/mad.gif" alt="mad" title="mad" height="15" width="15" />
If you want to get back onto coffee you could always tell her its not the coffee making you cranky, its her. One way or the other you'll be allowed all the coffee you can drink. <img src="<>/wink.gif" alt="wink" title="wink" height="15" width="15" />
Secondly, this is the first class I have heard off that are arguing to have their rating increased (reflect the boat is faster). If you believe it is a gift rating compared to an A or F18, you are a fool to ague agaist this advantage. No other class will.
It only sounds like little brother syndrome and nothing else. The F16 class is better than that.
What you all seem to forget is that here in Europe the F16 Uni ( Formula 16 1.008, Formula 16 Uni 0.982 Formula 18 1.005 ) gives time away to the F18, we have no chance of competing with the F18 as a uni sailor, my understanding is that in America it is the other way around. Mind you in real terms the 2 minutes per hour is really academic to say the least.
John Jalani got it just about right when he said on the water we just keep up with the F18's and no more, whether or not we are uni or dual. The SCHRS as it is set up cannot compute the single handed factors like not having enough hands and the extra delay in sail handling that a Uni dictates and in my opinion the formulae should be able to allow such factors. I'm sure Scooby Simon would disagree.
To date in all the sailing I have recently been to, there has never been a big enough fleet of F18's to warrant excluding the F16's but then I tend to only go to competitions where other F16's are and that tends to be our TT's with the exception of Simons home event, where the F18's are taking no prisoners and will run over you and protest rather than take a poor race result. In those cicumstances I would rather not sail with them but then I'm a bit of a wuss ( most of the time ). Seeing 5 or 6 F18's start and then 5 - 6 F16's seems daft to me, yes on the bigger events where numbers are higher say around 20 or more, then have seperate starts, on the smaller event just lump them all together.
To date in all the sailing I have recently been to, there has never been a big enough fleet of F18's to warrant excluding the F16's but then I tend to only go to competitions where other F16's are and that tends to be our TT's with the exception of Simons home event, where the F18's are taking no prisoners and will run over you and protest rather than take a poor race result. In those cicumstances I would rather not sail with them but then I'm a bit of a wuss ( most of the time ). Seeing 5 or 6 F18's start and then 5 - 6 F16's seems daft to me, yes on the bigger events where numbers are higher say around 20 or more, then have seperate starts, on the smaller event just lump them all together.
We've already had the conversation about the F18 drivers being over aggressive a$$holes so I won't revisit that. But, I still find it odd you want to sail with those kind of people.
One more thing... if the F16 fleet gets the numbers you want your fleet will be the home of over aggressive a$$holes, that's just how it works.
Oh so true and I guess its the same for most sports.
Yes I do want to go and sail with F18's at big comps, its kind of fun and thrilling to line up with 20 other boats plus the more people at an even the bigger the party afterwards. Sort of something you just gotta go and do at least once a year.
Then you probably don't want to dump on the people you're encouraging to sail with you, I'm just sayin.
What the hell's wrong with you, all rational and courteous and schidt? You haven't given a boot in the nutz in months.
Feelin' ok?
Feelin' ok?
It takes a lot of effort Pete and I'm trying something new. You know, the same could be said about you too... yeah, yeah it's the decaf.
Kum bay ya. . .
Err not sure where I've been dumping on people, if so sorry, all I'm saying is that in my opinion the F16, F18, and A class should all start together at smaller comps, nothing less nothing more, if we want a class winner then recording the times acroos the line should give us just that.
The upside is we don't all have to hang around for 3 starts and can get back to the beach party sooner. <img src="<>/cool.gif" alt="cool" title="cool" height="15" width="15" />
I read a lot of forums... and the F16 forum does the most in-fighting BY FAR!
Sort your **** out guys!
G'day Mitch,
Loads of people are pretty tough behind the security of their computer screen & keyboard. <img src="<>/shocked.gif" alt="shocked" title="shocked" height="15" width="15" />
My parents get into an argument at least ones a day, but I have never seen two people being more devoted to eachother; even after 42 years of being together.
Having disagreements out in the open doesn't necessarily mean that there is no respect or concensus at the end of the day.
Difficult issues will not go-away when you ignore them or limit yourself to being nice all the time.
That was a lesson well taught by my folks.
Wouter
I think your on the money Marcus... it's not a good look for what is potentially a great class!
Maybe a few individuals need an introduction to sailing anarchy where they can vent their opinion? Works for me!
Sort your * out guys!
The F16 forum at formula16.net, where the F16 class members are, is far more tame. Discussions are civilized, agreements are reached, documents are published, votes are taking place. The problems of the F16 forum here at catsailor.com are two fold:
- Wouter abrasive way of stating stuff which is rubbing quite a lot of people the wrong way;
- People outside the class with an agenda trying to stir * by stating stupid things (Minimum weight anyone?).
The sailors in the class can't care less about those people opinions: they are not class members and Wouter is not part of the class anymore.
The people I sail with in the UK are fine people. The people I'm going to meet at the Europeans in Italy are going to be great I'm sure. Only the ones nobody sees on the water sailing an F16 are apparently compelled to explain why the class they never tried is a bad idea.
So I disagree with you, it's not in-fighting. There is no in-fighting really, only people from the outside not wanting in and being butt.
Frankly, it's a mystery to me why this class is attracting all the nutters...