THE HORROR!!!! THE HORROR!!!

You buyin' a Blade!? <img src=

alt=

/>

Well, I wouldn't mind having one, but there isn't anyone here that has one so I'm suppose to get an old F17 from a guy (that was very hard to beat back in the day) that doesn't sail anymore. Then I get the easy job of trying to beat up on the local F17 guys...............(I'll just sheet in and kick that guy's butt!)

Tom

Future F17 #137 (if the deal goes thru)

There is one other blade in pensacola (and my boat is there, but I don't suppose that counts). This is the same as the N17s int he area right now, no? If you get a N17 then there will be 2 N17s and one blade. If you get a Blade there will be 2 blades, 1 N17. I believe bob is still trying to sell his too... right?
don't quote me on this... and I am not trying to be a [censored] (I don't have anything against the N17 for teh most part <img src=

alt=

/> but the blade has a little more future IMO in the panhandle than the N17. Now Michigan, where I am... probably not the case for now at least.

movie line.

Light girlie voice.

Who's motorcycle is this?

Mans voice

It's a chopper Baby.

Light girlie voice

who's chopper is this?

light girlie voice

Who's Zed?

Harley kicks into life and mans voice.
"Zed's dead baby, Zed's dead.

Gotta be

PULP Fiction!

Maybe, Tom is actually trying to buy Bob's I-17 ?

In that case there will still be only one in the Pensacola area ! <img src=

alt=

/>

Wouter

With Tom, Bob and Hobien (Nathan) lurking about on the F16 forum from time to time I figured it was time to check out the Nacra F17 (Inter-17) forum again. From what I can determine there are 7 threads with 17 posts made over the last 3 months. Of these 17 posts, 6 posts are calls to sailors to register themselves for the Nacra F17 nationals last july.

17 posts is about 2 days worth of postings on the F16 forum. (16570/6 years = average 7.6 posts a day)

I'm beginning to understand why we have them visiting the F16 forum. And you know what ? I think the F16 forum will only become better by that. Keeps us sharp, keeps them sharp. So welcome Bob, Tom, and Nathan !

However, having so little activity on the F17 forum does not mean that it is isn't informative !

Read this post at the bottom of this thread :

http://nacraclass.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=..._id=9&page=

I quote :

So we can mark down the 7th version of the former Inter-17 One-design class. I'm beginning to understand why they have chosen to call this class FORMULA 17. They have very limited rule base however. All the boats are 17 foot long and are build by Nacra. In all other aspects the versions differ quite considerably. <img src=

alt=

/>

Still, it is really a pitty that the importer has decided to make this change. Don't get me wrong, this is good for the F16 class, but I really do feel a little sorry for the F17 volunteers. How do you build an international class when every importer/agent/year changes the design.

I really do feel that the Nacra F17 (as in the Inter-17R) was the best version of all and that it has the best shot of making it internationally of all the earlier versions (although it is still not likely to do so). But placing an infusion F18 mast on top is really not helpful. It will be very stiff and heavy and with its length at 9.15 mtr it will also have a negative impact on the pitching of the boat. If the Nacra F17 carbon mast makes any good use of the carbon laminate then the weight difference between that and the Alu Infusion mast will be about 6 kgs (on total of about 25 kg for the alu rig (mast+fittings+sails etc)). Roughly 25%.

The Nacra F17 mainsail size (16.5 sq.mtr.) is already very close to the F18 size (17sq. mtr). Basically the EU sailors will be handling the stiffer and heavier F18 mainsail rig (without a jib) on a smaller and lighter platform. The big boy spi at 19 sq. mtr. isn't that much smaller then the F18 spi of 21 sq. mtr. either.

That is a rather big and heavy engine on a relatively small singlehander when considering the EU sailing conditions. Singlehanded righting goes out the door as well. And all current EU owners of Inter-17's (old EU version) are layed-off because of a rating difference of 6 points between the two designs. It all adds up; the class starts all over again on the EU market.

Honestly, I don't rejoyce in this development despite the fact it will make competiting with these Nacra F17's on the EU market easier. I rather have a more evenly matched competition.

Wouter

I liked the look of the I17 when it first came out but my problem with the class was it is stricktly a one person race boat, there is no option to race it with two persons and a jib. And I have heard the older boats are quite a bit heavier than the new boats, which doesn't help the resale value. Does the class even publish a minimum boat weight? Max sail area? Mast height? I hear the -new- F17's weigh about 340, which is 100 lbs. more than the F16.

When a bunch of us had Inter 20's we tried to get Nacra to support some kind of a one design rule set but they wouldn't do it, they wanted the ability to change the specs. any time they wanted to,

to sell more boats

.

All those changes just ran the price up and now nobody's buying them (new), and there isn't even a fleet in Florida anymore. We had 1 I20 show up at Wildcat last weekend. A few years ago we had 8. If Nacra supports the F17 class like they did the I20 class, well, in a couple years there won't be any around.

Another single handler that'll take two to right... <img src=

alt=

/>

Actually my prize possession these days is my Litespeed. It's a 2004 Litespeed Vortex Titanium Bike, 59cm with Dura Ace components, Mavic Ksyrium Wheelset, Thomsom X2 Seat Post. Weighs in at just under 16 pounds without the pedals.

Right now, I'm torn between another boat or a Trek Carbon Fiber Madone!

Sorry to bore you guys with the cycling BS.............I know; I know, wrong forum

Tom

ps. Those bike racers and Triathletes are hard to keep up with. You need every advantage you can get. It really gets tough after about 70-75 miles............

pps. You know, that H 16 dude had a good point over on the Juana's post. Maybe I'll get the Madone and a good used H 16! (if I could find one). My last one was a beauty. It was a 1983 and I got it for $1,700.00 in 1995. Probably used about 10X. Hey Wouter, maybe you can come over and crew for me. My old crew, my rockstar son recently got married and moved away.........

Juana's isn't the only good race around here for the H 16's. There's also both races over at Ocean Springs. Slip to Ship and Island Hop sometimes with as many as 12-15 H 16's in the fleet at least before Katrina.........

Actually you can race the F 17 with two persons and the jib in an open Spinnaker fleet like they had at Juana's or the one at Island Hop. I used to run the jib singlehanded. I would receive lots of complaints especially after beating up on Nacra 20's and F18 Tigers boat for boat. But it was legal!

http://www.osyc.com/Race_Results/ihop2005html/results_hip2005.htm

BTW, I pitchpoled on race 2. Too much sail up. I needed a furler!

Thom ,
Interesting stuff.
How much would the bike be worth.
If you get the new bike would you be interested in selling the old titanium framed bike. 59cm is just my size.
I'm a bit like you in a much as I'm riding as much as I can and looking for a new bike.
Regards,
Phill

Sorry Phill, no way would I part with that Ti frame. I got that bike for $3,300.00 used from Litespeed in Chattanooga, TN when they had their trade in program going. I'm guessing you know what a new Vortex is going for $6,000.00? Also, I know about Carbon Fiber. I've broken one F 17 mast already. Got hit by about a 30 knot gust with main sheet completely loose. My first summer of owning the boat we had this little storm come through when I was out on the bay. Also, I have learned a lesson about selling my equipment. I never should have sold my F 17/ I17R whatever you want to call it.............

Thanks for the reply.
Just looking for a titanium frame bike at 59cm.
Given your post it was worth a shot.
As far as stuff goes- if something is dear to me I won't sell it. I am much more inclined to give it away because there is no point in asking for money if it does not compensate.
Money can't replace what is dear.
You may see this as twisted.

Can't help that.

I hope you get your F17.

I have a 60km ride planned with a sailing buddy in the early morning. Better go and get some sleep.
Bye.

Regards,
Phill

My wife gave her entire music collection to Goodwill. Over 1,000 albums.

The F 17 was my first Spin Boat. Also, sometimes during distance races I would be running the main, jib, and spin while out on the trapeze. The spinnaker would be cleated to a cam cleat I had mounted on the hull. So the Main, Jib, and Spin were all cleated. My only controls were the main traveller, rudders, and weight distribution................ pitchpoles are almost guaranteed. So, you get pretty good at righting the thing. You just stand on the daggerboard with righting line in hand, lean back some, and she'll come right up. (of course, you gotta clean up a lot of mess before you can do that. There are lines and sails everywhere!)

I'm thinking the new F 17's are around 305-310lb's. Mast ht. 30'4"

I would probably still get the old F 17 even if that other guy sold his. I like to distance race and the F 17 with jib will really fly. I think the extra 2' of length helps in those waves offshore. Plus, I can always add an extra set of trap wires and possibly get my old crew on board for the Slip to Ship and Horn Island Hop races. You F 16 guys should really consider these two races. (you might even be able to get your own class if you have 5 boats show up) You race out to either Ship Island or Horn Island for Race 1 (a distance of maybe 12-15 miles offshore). Once there, they have fried chicken and beverages. You relax for a while eat, drink, rest, (for us older types) and be merry. Then you race back for Race 2(the wind is usually up all the way by this race). Once back, they feed you again! Well, all this is pre-Katrina. I don't know if you get the meal after you return or not these days. Sunday is Race 3 around Deer Island which is much closer to shore. No real open water to cross. The 2005 Island Hop had 44 boats! The islands are uninhabited and really nice to visit. The fun part for out of towners there for their first race is trying to see the island they are racing to if the weather is a bit hazy. For the race back in, you can usually use one of the high rise casinos as a landmark to stir by. Just ask a local which one is the best.

Oh, almost forgot. Once at the island for the Horn Island race, they have a sort of beauty contest where you vote for that year's Miss Horny Island!! There is a picture floating around somewhere here on CS for year 2006!

Tom

The difference in hull length is actually only (5.240 - 5.000) = 0.240 mm or less then 10 inches = less then 1 foot.

The F16's are longer then 16 feet. But the name F5 didn't sound as good as F16 and so we went for F16. Actually the inter 17 (F17) is not 17 feet either, it too is is a little longer. Same applies to the F18's now that we are discussing it. The F18's are 20 inches longer then the F16 and so less then 2 feet longer.

Wouter

I'm still getting the F17 as being 17' 10

or approx. 5.5 meters while the F16 is 16'4

. ( 17'10

-16'4

)= 1'6" which then can be rounded off to the nearest whole number or 2' for ease of discussion. Please check my math on this one

Thomm,
Your spending far too much time on the F16 Forumm to be buying an F17.

Not that there is anything wrong with That.

I'll

second

the Slip-to-Ship race. It is worth putting on your calendar if you are in the FL Panhandle to eastern TX area. Great host club. Alas, there is no dinner on Sat night as the club house was washed away. Great times on the beach though - lots of camping and revelry.

I have never done Horn Island Hop as it is is usually around July 4thish and the winds are a little iffy. I am SURE Ocean Springs Yacht Club puts on a good show though.

According to Nacra the F17 is 17' 5

.

http://nacra.us/F17/Findex.html

Enjoy the boat <img src=

alt=

" />.

Phill,

Did you guys do your 60km bike ride the other day?

Tom

Let's see, if 40km is approx. 25 miles then 60km is about 37 miles. Sounds like a nice ride.

Hey, this must be Metric Conversion Day on the F16 site

Thomm,

you know, Phill is right, you obviously like the F-16 guys so well that you should get an F-16. If you want to, you can sail one up with the jib on the F-16 too.. Just need to install a roller furler and modify your handicap.

I am about to get on my recumbent for the 13km return trip back home. Commuting by bike is golden..

Speaking of handicaps, you 'bent guys would need a lower one if they had handicaps in cycling. You guys look like you are sitting on the sofa at home, you're down out of the wind, and you ain't a lot of fun to draft behind. We have 5 or 6 recumbents in our riding group (4 of them are carbon fiber). Saturday am rides usually range from 47-73 miles. Sunday rides are about the same but the racers(and Tri Geeks) are there and it's a bit tougher.

I'm too lazy to commute........I usually do two 25 mile

recovery rides

during the week. My course goes right by Pensacola Pass which is the entrance to the Gulf of Mexico (for you folks that may not know). The water is almost always that Caribbean blue green. It's really pretty out there!

I wouldn't mind an F16, but the main competition in the area has an F17. Maybe if you guys took up a collection and bought him an F16 ..............

Looks like you're right. Maybe it's the H16 that's almost a foot longer than it's number........

BTW, that's a nice picture of the High Aspect Ratio Main on the F17.

We pay for the relaxed riding position when going uphill dragging a relatively heavy bike without the option of standing up, but on the flats and downhill it's a real joy. I dont mind climbing either when I can gear down for it, but keeping up with an upright can be a challenge then. If I lost 15Kgs and developed some more leg muscles..

How many F-17s are there and how large is the beachcat community? It has been stated that the performance of the F-16 and F-17 is so close that they could sail in the same fleet, first over the line wins. I dont know personally about that, but it sounds reasonable.

Maybe this regatta could be used to demonstate how close the two boats are. Check the elapsed times. It may be best just to compare my times to Miss Lindsay's times. Once that #1 boat got warmed up, he was out there some.

http://home.comcast.net/~john.e.williams/Prelim%20Results.htm

But that is the F16 with crew. Too bad there wasn't an F16 there singlehand. This was in November of 2004 I think.

Well, on the other hand, this example might be too old. These F17 guys are probably much faster these days.

17'10

and 17'5

are both wrong. Maybe they are including the pintles. Wouldn't be the first time that data on an official nacra website was wrong (ready to sail boat weights anyone ?)

I trust the Texel measurements as they are made by an independent party and they measure waterline length next to overall length (ex pintles etc)

For the data look here :

http://www.watersportverbond.nl/data/numdet_22-6-2007.pdf

Texel measures the Nacra F17 at 5.240 mtr overall and 5.230 mtr waterline length. And the European importer and owner of the Nacra brand seems to agree , http://www.nacraeurope.com/nacra17.php

F16's have 5.000 mtr for both mearurements. Ergo the difference is 0.24 mtr at max = 10 inches.

This makes the Nacra F17 on its hulls ex pintles 17 foot and 2.3 inches long.

Wouter

1 boat in the state that does not travel and that constitutes

The main competition

.... Give us a break.

Please pull you nose out of the FAD's hind end and go post on the F17 site with the rest of your budies.