Single handed correction factor???

HI Mark

hope the sailing season is going well -

-Believe most cats raced are fleet oriented ,-look at roster lists of races like the catfight -100 plus cats -One design mfg or fleet racing is the preference of most racing cat sailors .

-Porthmouth comm should not presume to establish class rules ,-min weights or otherwise . -as stated numerous times by many others.

-Agree -the P scorekeepers are going crazy trying to follow all these design modification factors to an averaged time human performance oriented rating system .

-A rating system based like the A Class on the basics LENGTH -BEAM -SAIL AREA -and WEIGHT for all cats is eventually inevitable.-This also allows and encourages cats of similar length beam wght and sail area to modify into equal racing fleets . -The desire and preference to do so is eveident in many posts and proposals from different parts of the country from many racing catsailors-,-5.5 uni adding a spin to race equally --,-Fox and I-20 as a basis for U S F-20 racing---interest in F -16 AND -18 RACING in the US and the numerous cats built to these rules ,--and growth and-interest in the A Class -as examples-

-

-Believe this is a much better direction for U S Catsailors ,much more in cynk with the rest of the catsailing world ,and allows us to shape future design towards safer better catamaran designs and products available through more structured directed compeditive events.

-and yes ,-would be pleased to work on this ratings problem with others interested,-and have always thought the current people administering the present rating system have done an excellent job and when the system changes or is corrected should remain doing so with our gratitude for their contributions to the sport, -

-simply have never agreed with the basic counter productive ideal of the Porthmouth rating system since first racing under it in 1978-and evan then first racing,- recognized its desrepencies and shortfalls.

-Hope the NE 100 GOES WELL for all ,--looking forward to the race reports and updates this weekend.

-keep smiling through all the sailing miles and years -

-all the best -

Carl

Hi Carl

I look at the Huge turnout for the upcoming Cat fight and draw a very different conclusion. The catfight is a huge sucssess BECAUSE it is NOT a one design regatta. Nigel's Spring Fever regatta is run with a similar format. There are NO one design regattas in the country that are even close in participation. Chris Brown and Tom Korz recently wrote asking the Cat fight committe to split out the I20's. I applaud their holding to their vision and rejecting their request.

I think that the turnout for these events is large because you will participate in a huge fun event and you will compete against everyone. The format is inclusive, The nationals are a great chance to sort out the one design competiion. Both events are worth participating in.

Take Care

Mark

At CABB's Blackledge Distance Race we had a couple of Hobie 17s, but one was a Sport.

There was not modification number for a two-up boat (the Hobie 17 Sport) to be single-handed (the sailors did not have a crew). All because of these percentage FAT BOY things.

I ran into the same problem when I sailed by Taipan 4.9 Uni with a crew in the Key Largo Steeplechase (No single-handed sailing allowed) How could there be a percentage of minimum weight, if the class has no minimum weight?

So, bring back the two-up sailing single handed, and the one-up sailing with two.

Trouble there is most of the fleets do not have Minimimum Weights, so there is no way you can do percentage modifications.

So, in order to come up with some sort of fair number we used the uni with a jib modification.

Seems the Modifications just try too hard to catch it all, then leave behind the standards that have worked so well over the past 40 years.

Rick White

Rick White

Catamaran Sailor Magazine

email: rick@catsailor.com

Hi Mark -

-If you actuall sailed these events you may draw a more realistic conclusion ,-please drive over and race this weekend on Lake Mich. if possible , see for yourself .

--Awards and trophies are given out by class ,-The I-20 s will race each other ,just as other larger class sailors will .

-Again ,-the overwhelming preference of racing sailors is towards equal fleet racing , not handicap ,-which is never completely equal or fair ,-P-RATINGS ARE NOT THE REASON FOR THE LARGE TURNOUTS . Your applauding a false notion .

-When first starting to race {70s early 80s}we would typically have 300 plus boats in attendance at divisional area championships .40 or 50 boat fleets in A B AND C classes.

-It is time to face the reality per earlier examples listed of the overwhelming majority of racing sailors rather than applauding pretence of false notions Again most racing sailors are most active and purchase a cat with fleet racing in mind ,-18 Formula -look at the responce ,-look at this board ,-A-class racing ,--F-16 CLass racing ,-F-20 racing ,-should.nt our open racing fleets be modeled after these prefered IDEALS -

-Most have a vision of setting high standards and goals for achievement in design and sailing ability ,-as design ratings and the formation of equal fleet racing allows us to accomplish towards the future.

-Yours seems to be to try by any means to assign an average time to sailors as a goal ,-Is an average time a goal to aspire to for U S catamaran sailors ,-I hope not..

-Let's plan a better direction and future for cat sailing .-

-

Hi Carl..

you wrote

-If you actual sailed these events you may draw a more realistic conclusion ,-please drive over and race this weekend on Lake Mich. if possible , see for yourself .

MS… Plan to…. Leaving Tuesday Morning ! See you there!

--Awards and trophies are given out by class ,-The I-20 s will race each other ,just as other larger class sailors will .

-Again ,-the overwhelming preference of racing sailors is towards equal fleet racing , not handicap ,-which is never completely equal or fair ,-P-RATINGS ARE NOT THE REASON FOR THE LARGE TURNOUTS .

MS… Ok… What is the reason? NO other one-design event comes close other then nationals. We also award trophies for divisions of 5 or more boats within a Portsmouth start. This works well!!! but does not generate 120 boats at Division 11 events.

Carl, I am not arguing that people don't prefer one design over Portsmouth. If I could convince all 20-foot sailors to race Tsports I would be delighted. This will not happens so…. Now what? You suggest a formulae class… see below.

-your applauding a false notion .

-When first starting to race {70s early 80s}we would typically have 300 plus boats in attendance at divisional area championships .40 or 50 boat fleets in A B AND C classes.

MS…In the 70’s and 80’s there were Hobie 16’s and Hobie 18’s and perhaps Prindle 16’s. They were basically the ONLY cats popularly raced. In 2001, there are many more boat types out on the water and far fewer casual sailors!! This is a different circumstance and requires a different solution.

-It is time to face the reality per earlier examples listed of the overwhelming majority of racing sailors rather than applauding pretence of false notions Again most racing sailors are most active and purchase a cat with fleet racing in mind ,-18 Formula -look at the responce ,-look at this board ,

MS. ..F18 racing. I certainly hope that this market succeeds However, the tides of history are against the class though. In the mid Atlantic.. we have never had a large group of sailors racing 18-foot boats. The P18-2 failed, the Nacra 5.5 sloop failed, the Mystere 5.5 sloop failed, the Inter 18 was never sold here. The (2)Hobie Tigers hail from Syracuse New York, 9 hours away! In fact, teams that should sail 18 foot boats will move up to 20’s and take their lumps on the rare days when it blows 15 knots or better. Can you point to a single F18 start (much less region of the country) where this class is growing. I hope so… but in the event that you can’t… the Catfight will allow those dead boat society sailors to compete more or less equally with the dominant 20-footer class. (H20 and I20’s)

-A-class racing ,--F-16 Class racing ,-F-20 racing ,-should.nt our open racing fleets be modeled after these prefered IDEALS –

MS…. The F20 class ideal has never come to fruition. I can think of at least 2 previous attempts to come up with formulae for level racing. The sailors who have Nacra 6.0’s, and Mystere 6.0’as and Hobie 20’s rejected this idea by failing to buy into the proposal.

Now the I20’s and the Fox’s and Tsports will appear to be unequal with respect to sail area. Once again… we are stuck with respect to F20’s. The Tsport is the international Olympic class… It cannot change any of its parameters…. The I20’s have a large group of sailors already… They are not willing to reduce sail area to match the euro rules. The Fox’s are a developing US Class and seem to have a new/old mast … I am not sure what sail area they will eventually agree on… I predict… they will not match the I20’s because they dream that the H on the sail will draw all one-design racers to their fleet and they will need to be somewhat different to market the boat. Perhaps you have a solution to this dilemma Carl… Until you enroll all the 20 foot sailors in the country… I suggest the Portsmouth ratings will do quite nicely.

-Most have a vision of setting high standards and goals for achievement in design and sailing ability ,-as design ratings and the formation of equal fleet racing allows us to accomplish towards the future.

MS… Vision is not the issue… implementation is the whole ball game here. How do you transform the racing fleets in the US and Canada ? This is not trivial… Until a mechanism emerges… the Portsmouth system works .

-Yours seems to be to try by any means to assign an average time to sailors as a goal ,-Is an average time a goal to aspire to for U S catamaran sailors ,-I hope not..

-Let's plan a better direction and future for cat sailing .-

MS… Well we have had this debate on Portsmouth several times. At the end of the day … the rating is the rating. If it works… i.e. fairly rates boats of similar types, then you have a useable and fair rating system. I assert that Portsmouth wind speed rating works for all of the popular boats… Your job is easy now. … Define a rating that is in error and point to a race or group of data that supports your argument. The catfight should give you a lot of data from which to make your argument. I am sure the Portsmouth committee would be interested in your opinion and take it under consideration.

See you this weekend.

Mark Schneider

-Hi Mark -

GREAT -glad your driving over ,-Lake MI is beautiful ,a freshwater ocean . -A drysuit or wetsuit is a must when the wind kicks in ,-always cold water below the surface temps is the only negative ,-it is a great sailing sight .

-Hope there is some good T COMPETITION for you-

Not sure if Matt and W F will be back in time or what they would sail . Have great expectations at theT Euros for them .

-Hope you enjoy the 3 days of bouys racing , and we have the full range of good weather and wind speeds,and all have a great time .

-On ratings ,-the P Commitee have no interest in other potentially better systems ,-it seems a waste of time discussing it .

-Implementation and developing more interest in the alternative mechanism is the point of responding to ratings oriented posts ,

-As stated earlier many racing sailors already are developing and actively involved in alternatives,-f-16 18 20s -A class -racing etc,-The concept is to form an alternate rating system reflecting and helping fasilitate those ideals.-A WORTHY GOAL --worth continueing to voice an opinion for , and work on with others of similar interests .

-My bouys racing has been limited ,-only raced 3 days this season ,starts and shute sets and gybes are terrible ,-but am going to have a good time ,-work on boat speed in various conditions ,-and hopefully learn some new ideas and sailing techniques from others as well as catch up on new cat designs and cats being raced.

-Let me know if I can help with information or in any regard ,and look forward to talking sailing with you ,-

-Always enjoy Virginia Bch each May ,-

-Carl

I for one enjoy handicap racing. I'm not a die hard competitor but I'm in it for enjoyment and personal gratification through continual improvement. I just started sailing and racing this year with my Nacra 5.2 and find it intellectually challenging to sail against a variety of boats with different advantages and handicaps. Heck, it makes me feel a lot better to just finish in front of someone, even if I lose to 'em on rating! .

Seriously though - I think both types of racing have a place in the American sailing community and I will probably get into class racing when I get more serious (and better) at racing - which is pretty close to my point. In a broad generalization, I would consider class racing for the more hard core serious competitors who need a completely level field in order to benchmark their success. I'm happy with the variety of handicap racing because I'm not quite so serious a competitor (or threat) and can easily find a benchmark or challenge among a variety of boats. The atmosphere among handicap sailors (even at the whole Spring Fever Regatta) seems more family like than what I've seen in the class racers too (again a general and potentially unfounded observation).

The nostalgic view - I really like the N5.2 because I think it's the perfect sized boat for my physical, technical, and financial needs. I want to be able to race what I want and not forced into another area just to compete (damn right I'm an American!!). Certain areas of the country focus on certain types / brands of boats and I also want the freedom to travel and compete regardless of what I own.....ahhh I could go on and on.....

[color]Jake

[color]Nacra 5.2 (2112)

[color]Hobie 18 (???)

Jake wrote:

Heck, it makes me feel a lot better to just finish in front of someone, even if I lose to 'em on rating! .

Hi Jake... I agree with you. I started racing with CRAC when Laurie Dowley the fleet secretary called one day and said... you know you are on the mailing list... you might as well come out and try a race... could be fun." We sailed though the start finish line backwards for the first race (we knew this but we were just late).... By the last race... we had managed a 2nd place. The initial small victories were passing someone... ANYone on the race course. I believe that highly competitive clubs and fleets forget how most of us got into racing catamarans... When I think about it now... my first taste of racing was in trying to catch somebody daysailing off of Sandy Point Mayland. The progression can be addictive.

Sadly, there are no daysailors at Sandy Point these days and the opportunities for casual sailors to get sucked into racing are rare. Portsmouth racing allows you to race your 5.2 against well sailed Hobie 16's... you will lose on time.. but everyone will win in the end if your passion in cat racing is kindled when you pass one of the local 16 hot shots. A one design fleet is a great place to race for a while. Hope to see you marching up that ladder.

Have fun with you N5.2.... I sailed an older 5.2 with a freakin bar in the center of tramp... other then that I had a blast with it in the ocean. Your karma indicates that you may well wind up on a different kind of boat... cause your an american.. and thats what you want to do!!! (grin)

Take Care

Mark

.....the one ahead of me that I'm trying to pass and the one behind me that I'm trying to stay ahead of! Note that this statement is boat type- and size-independent!

Sail fast and have fun,
Alan Thompson
I20 - San Diego

GO JAKE!

Jake is right on. If it is the goal to increase participation, you must live with the variety of boats that people want for whatever reason they want them. I bet that MOST folks out there race only a few times per year and do far more recreational sailing, which precludes a one-design choice. Portsmouth will be your answer here unless you can figure out a way to make it worth it to folks to spend money to conform to the Formula formulae. And if the general populace isn't willing to buy boats for one-design... well, guess what, they ain't gonna buy to Formula either.

Or you can live with the low turnouts of hot-dog sailors. Your choice.

The Coast Catamaran Club does it this way: if we get enough boats to make a class (5) well, they get one. If there isn't, they get thrown into one of usually two open classes, split by rating. What we see in turnout is usually 8-10 H16s, 8-10 H18s, and 20-30 various flavors of boats that get split into the two open classes. Note, the MAJORITY of our regatta participants do NOT sail one-design.

Hi Alan -

-In a start with 70 plus other cats this racing strategy may work well .

-The post last week on Porthmouth ratings summed up most racing sailors feelings on the subject -

quote ----'If your girth measurement is 10 times that of your mast length then you get the P-FATBOY TIME ALLOWANCE "

-unquote -

-As Gary Jobson stated in a recent article on ratings ,-the best type for small groups and local clubs may be a personal handicap system ,-just as is used in other sports like golf ,-new sailors would be handed a pennant or trophy for improving their sailing skills the most during the course of the season ,--What better way to encourage new sailors to partisipate ,--P-Does not do this ,---

-and in responce to a comment above -AMERICANS do not set goals and standards to be AVERAGE ,as P ENCOURAGES --You very rarely see a crowd at a sports event cheering ---we're number 3 or 4 or an average ,--we.re number 3 or 4 ---IT IS generally WE'RE NUMBER ONE !

-Do not know why anyone would attempt to equate Porthmouth rating as being an American ideal ,-it is a silly a notion as the rating system itself that has become a gross distortion of conflicting ideas --An average time human performance rating with an every growing list of modification factors in a vein attempt to correct the initial misconception of ideals that the P system rating authors never intended to have apply.

-WE can not make the world FAIR for everyone ,-we can establish laws -rules ,-and most importantly CONCEPTS and IDEALS to aspire to and hold belief and hope that basic freedoms quarenteed in these ideals produce people of integrity and character which in turn allows these people the basic freedoms required to create evolve learn and grow .This has always been the priority though we as a people often forget this .

-The current P rating system is counter productive to these ideals ,has become a typicaly beureaucratic mess ,entrenched in conflicting regulation ,,difficult to interpret and administer ,as Rick stated ,--and does not help facilitate the direction evolution and goals of most racing sailors per A Class type and the desire for equal fleet type racing per examples previously given .

-Porthmouth rating has become an obstruction on the course of U S cat sailing evolution that most just ignore and sail around ,while many others are seeking active paths in design developement and the formation of equal class racing groups.

-Look around ,-

-Carl

-

-

Carl,

Since you have been advocating a different rating system for several years now, I assume you have made signifigant progress on what that rule should be. Please share your draft rating system with us so we can more fully evaluate whether it is an improvement or not.

Eric

Hi Eric -

Hope the N E 100 WENT WELL -

sorry I did not make it over ,-kids ,work ,the usual demands of time ,-have really enjoyed sailing out of New London and Mystic Conn. in years past ,--just having lunch ,looking thru the sailing forums ,

-Suggest looking at the interest in Tigers and F-18 racing ,-

-The interest of finding a way for the Fox -Inter 20 and others to race equally forming the basis of F-20racing in the U S ,--The formation and growing interest of many U S sailors in the F-16 CLASS ,-and the several existing classes that includes ,-check the web site AND ,the ideals spelled out ,--the model of the A Class ,--basic box rule as a basis for rules and rating developement ,-

Other rules used as the ISAF for small cats ,-Texel ,-and AU rating rule based in design .

-The tactic you and several others use over the last few years is personal attack on those who make observations in the developements in cat sailing , and voice an opinion on them in an open forum , here for all of us ,

-Personal attack is-a childish waste of time ,-and the clearest indication to many of the flawed thinking process reflective of the current rating system .

-As stated numerous times would be happy to work with others with similar interests as time and experience allows and for myself ,certainly do not pretend to have all the answers , but clearly see and understand the ideals and obvious methode based on existing trends and developements for a better more directed future for the sport as many other U S catsailors do.

-Sailwave allows us to score races using the existing 3 main scoring systems ,P -ISAF and Texel -for comparison and objective annalysis would again request that this information be posted on catsailor or made available to all to access ,and again suggested that we start posting results in these various existing rating systems for several major races around the country . Many sailors have downloaded the Sailwave scoring system and would enjoy the opportunity to compare and comment on the merits of the rating systems ,beginning a meaningfull dialogue , and leading to improved and better rating systems .

-

Carl

-Concepts are to adopt a design based rating rule giving definative equation to each design parameter ,-the basics being length .sail area ,weight ,and beam , with other secondary design features given a proportional percentage factor in the rating equation --Once this is accomplished as per existing ISAF OR Texel or as other developed rating systems evolve,-we can then allow upgrades and modifications to existing boats to form equal racing classes ,-

Others may choose to stay in the ratings class ,-but we will then have a choise ,we do not have now ,-and we will learn from the experimentations encouraged by design ratings ,as well as encourage some great racing in unified sailing classes ,that have proven successfull and are well established in other parts of the catsailing world . More good SAFER FASTER designs to these rules will be produced as we have already witnessed in responce by several boat manufacturers. -More sailors purchasing new cats will be assured of finding equal fleet racing preferred by most .

-All of this is already occuring ,-is this naturally evolving future direction for racing really that difficult to comprehend .?

-

- summery of previous comments seem to be that this will not work because of various past partial attempts at this and supposedly the rating is the rating and we are stuck with it , and if you don,t agree with the obvious flaws of P point to example and THEY will concider it . ---

-NOT BUYING ANY OF THIS BULL -

-The obvious fatal flaw of P is that it hides and masks false concepts and very poorly sailed designs with much higher REAL speed potential in AVERAGED TIMES ,-in a bell curve of racing result averages ,-in a c grade ,-in the false belief and concept that averages relate to true potential ,-THEY DO NOT .-Using a flawed system to disprove a flawed system which is what is being asked of catsailors is as most already understand not realistic .The true answers are in comparison to other existing working rating systems .

-Examples ,-as noted by Bill Roberts of the Tornado having advantages not reflected . -A quick calc indicates 1.5 more ft of beam over other similar cat designs giving it with an est 300 lb crew some 450 ft lbs more of righting moment capability ,if my math and terminology are correct ,-while also having lighter boat weight and somehow arriving through averages at a lower P number . Examples are numerous ,-cats with similar length beam weight and main jib area ,some are allowed huge spin areas and maintain much lower P ratings ,-

Common sence alone tells any that sail that this is a false conclusion based on poorly sailed averages not relating accurately to true speed potential and is certainly taken into consideration in other rating sysems .

- Again would request that freedom of information of all race results and actual times recorded be made available on Catsailor for many sailors with Sailwave scoring system ,easily downloaded by any from the U K CAT SITE -allowing unbias comparison of the existing rating systems ,-ISAF Texel and P ,-beginning a meaningfull diologue and annalysis and commentary ,with the goal of better rating systems for all .

-

Carl,

Perhaps my view is a bit unique because of my newness to the sport but in some ways, I think we're all complaining about the same thing. If I say

it's blue

, sure as doody stinks, someone's going to say

nope, it's purple

. By this I mean to say that there's no way everybody is going to agree on the best way to administrate a handicap system for all the various scenarios. I think that we ALL need to realize that handicaps are, and always will be, an imperfect system that not everybody is going to be happy with it. The best thing we can do is to keep it unfair (since we can't change that) but simple.

I've said before that I'm new to competition. I have a pretty good understanding of the existing Portsmouth system even as a novice sailor. My fear is that as it becomes more complex with items such as 'fat boy', there's going to be unanticipated loopholes making it more uneven (just look at our taxes and what a comittee has done with that - not only in the US!). This will inevitably result in frustrated and confused sailors (tax payers!). Handicaps are not perfect. They never will be and shouldn't be expected to be. When I feel compelled to compete in a more perfect system, that's when I get a boat I can class race with. Both systems have advantages and have gone through a lot of development over a lot of time. I suggest that before we monkey with them that we step back and make sure we understand the overall philosophy of both systems and agree on what they should achieve (and determine if it's 'the few' or 'the many' that's doing the complaining). Would I race for money in a handicap race? - probably not. You will, however, find me racing in a handicap race for a small trophy and a cup of beer (or three)!

BTW, I didn't mean to imply that the handicap system was an 'American ideal' - It was only an attempt to get a chuckle at the expense of us silly stateside people.

Happy sailing for all!

[color]Jake

[color]Nacra 5.2 (2112)

[color]Hobie 18 (???)

Hey Jake -

thanks for taking the time to respond ,-appreciate the concepts and thoughts and COMMENT on similarity to our disfuctional U S tax code,so often most abused by the politicians supposedly regulating it . Agree with all .

-The N 5-2 is a great cat ,-back when I first started sailing /racing there was a large fleet of them with CRAM -in MI ,--CRAM HAS A LONG HISTORY of excepting any and all types of catamarans . At the same time several of us purchased the then new Hobie 18 ,-Being similar size we all started together and all experienced some great racing ,and I think twice the competition and friendly rivalry developed into fleet challenges,-boat for boat . -Great fun ,-and maybe some of the first unofficial Formula racing ,--N-5-2 -H-18 fleet racing .

-The concept is nothing new ,and we can all see similar mfg.classes and ways to race together now ,--the H-Fox -I 20 ,-6-0 and others ,----numerous other examples listed . -

The key is to adopt a rating system that as this direction continues allows and helps facilitate the desire of many racing sailors into equal racing fleets .

-A worthwhile goal ,-a much better direction for the future of the sport ,-and as always worth voicing an opinion for .

>sailwave allows us to score races using the existing 3 main scoring systems ,P -ISAF and Texel -for comparison and objective annalysis would again request that this information be posted on catsailor or made available to all to access ,and again suggested that we start posting results in these various existing rating systems for several major races around the country . Many sailors have downloaded the sailwave scoring system and would enjoy the opportunity to compare and comment on the merits of the rating systems, beginning a meaningfull dialogue, and leading to improved and better rating systems.<

I'll add a facility to change rating systems for real when I get the chance - i.e. change all the values in the competitor details as the rating system is changed (as per the rating system library). Hmmm, could extend it to loop through a list of r systems, scoring as it went, generating some stats...

Colin Jenkins

www.sailwave.com

Hello Colin -

-Thanks so much for establishing Sailwave for all cat sailors -

furthering the system for equall comparison would be a great service .

--Congrates to all in establishing the U K Cat site and reorganizing cat sailing ,-really have enjoyed following the progress through e-mails and race results with stories ,-sounds like some great racing ,-and partying ,--it,s good to know catsailors are basically the same worldwide .

-Hope to see a major distance race in the U K in the near future ,--similar to the Worrell 1000 ,--maybe round Ireland -?

-We will keep in contact and be ready for both ,--catsailing and partying -

--for those of you that hav,nt yet ,--check the U K Cat site -

-- http://www.catamaran.co.uk/

-All the best -

Carl

-

-

--All the best -

Carl

Great Attitude!!

We have to ask ourselves as a sport of waning popularity, for every anal ultracompetitive already addicted sailor we pacify with ratings, weights and calculations and protest hearings, how many more newbys do we scare off or give a bad taste of sailing to? I kept sailing because of friends and starting to win. Less talented/lucky people would have quit when some irate dick hollers at them and protests for.... case in point - running single hand, H16 Class (blowing about 18 knots) (smoking the middle pack in

B

fleet for gawds sake) at my first proper race. What was I to do? Go home? Race comittee was ok with running me with the other dbl handed boats! I stayed out the trophies anyway (even with power righting techniques.)

Could have been a great week end. Havent been back to Texas since. I dont guess they miss me, but I can well imagine a person just quitting competitive sailing, which leads to eventually quitting sailing, for just such an occurence. Check your priorities people. And a big thanks to Doug, Missy Bill, Tami, Don, David, John, Mark etc who encourage me and others and keep a great sport alive.

Hi Carl,

>Thanks so much for establishing Sailwave for all cat sailors<

My pleasure...

>furthering the system for equall comparison would be a great service.<

OK I'll have a fiddle when I can. Keep an eye on the mailing list announcements for progress.

I have passed your comments about www.catamaran.co.uk to UKCRA - I'm sure they will enjoy reading them.

Regards,

Colin

www.sailwave.com